Author Topic: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West Developments  (Read 75492 times)

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Offline superceleb

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #70 on: September 20, 2006, 12:54:09 PM »
Seems like they are marketing Stonebridge Towers as Stonebridge Condominums now

Offline MayDay

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #71 on: September 20, 2006, 01:06:32 PM »
Goes without saying, but if someone can go with a camera, please try to get any pics of renderings/site plans they might have.

Thanks! :-)

Offline Map Boy

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #72 on: September 20, 2006, 02:47:09 PM »
I just rsvp'd, so I'm locked in!  I can't stay for the whole thing, however...

Offline urbanlife

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #73 on: September 20, 2006, 03:00:33 PM »
looks like gomez got a little confused.  here is the updated PD bit:


Stonebridge developers plan 1,500 new homes in Flats

12:08 p.m. (updated 3:06 p.m.)

The developers behind Stonebridge, already an unlikely success story on the west bank of the Flats, plan to add about 1,500 homes and 935,000 square feet of office and retail space to their growing neighborhood.

Architect Bob Corna and Doug Price, chief executive of K&D Group Inc., will announce the expansion tomorrow afternoon at a ribbon-cutting for the next two phases of their project.

http://www.cleveland.com/weblogs/business/index.ssf?/mtlogs/cleve_business/archives/2006_09.html#185711
« Last Edit: February 25, 2010, 05:44:45 PM by Mildtraumatic »
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Offline jamiec

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #74 on: September 20, 2006, 06:02:31 PM »
The PD posted a podcast interview with the Stonebridge people: http://www.cleveland.com/business/audio/index.ssf?/business/audio/kroll.html

I"m still trying to get it to work, lol. It was posted today, though.

edit: OH, snap, "wild dogs and dead bodies" =)

I LIKE WHAT CORNA IS SAYING! He wants to bring Tremont and Ohio City in there....cool.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2006, 06:07:00 PM by jamiec »

Offline Map Boy

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #75 on: September 20, 2006, 06:42:01 PM »
Good stuff.  He gets it.  He also microwaves his lunch.

He even touches on a few hot button political issues...gambling & tax abatement.

I wonder what his residents...current & future...would think about placing a casino at the fore of future phases for the West Bank.


Offline Map Boy

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #76 on: September 20, 2006, 07:43:13 PM »
Some of the same, plus some new details and questions.  I was hoping someone was looking into a TIF district with all this development going on and it sounds like they're on top of it!

Big plans for west bank of Flats
Henry J. Gomez
Plain Dealer Reporter

The developers behind Stonebridge already an unlikely success story on the west bank of the Flats want to add about 1,500 homes and 935,000 square feet of office and retail space to their growing neighborhood.

Doug Price, chief executive of K&D Group Inc., and partner Bob Corna will announce the expansion this afternoon at a ribbon-cutting for the next two phases of their project.

I know this sounds a little Disneyland-ish, said Corna, who envisions glass elevators and a series of walkways that connect the west and east banks with Whiskey Island.

Then again, Corna said, the mere idea of the neighborhood seemed Disneyland-ish when he first proposed it more than 10 years ago. With about 500 housing units already built or under construction, Stonebridge has surprised its original skeptics.

Prices on the existing Stonebridge units, almost all of which have been sold or leased, range from $140,000 for a one-bedroom plan to more than $1 million for a penthouse suite....

http://search.cleveland.com/Big+plans+for+west+bank+of+Flats?date_range=all

« Last Edit: February 25, 2010, 05:51:42 PM by Mildtraumatic »

Offline clvlndr

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #77 on: September 21, 2006, 02:03:43 AM »
other developers in cleveland should take note of their strategy and start small and keep growing.  there are 10 other areas near downtown where this type of approach would work - including many of the warehouse parking lots.    the legacy village/crocker park wholesale construction just doesn't work as well in the city. 

Amen!  Corna/Price have the formula down so right, esp for this city.  Think how successful, say, Stark could be if he took Stronebridge's approach and built a couple small, new buildings fronting Johnson/Jobbers/Chamberlain block on W. 6th -- think of how much synergy good looking new buildings mixed in w/ the warehouses would create toward developing an ongoing colossus like what Stonebridge has become.  But nooo.  Stark, like others, want to generate this bank/public-funded home run.  Doesn't work that way in Cleveland.  It usually ends up with a bunch of selfish, bickering chef's who want their piece as well as the project developed in their image.  This town  very conservative, esp toward downtown and in-town trendy areas.  It's very difficult to build consensus and momentum in Cleveland the way other cities do.  Neighborhoods we consider hot have taken years, decades to get where they are (and most, like Ohio City, which we consider great by our standards are, but most big city standars, still quite a ways away from being 'there' yet ... Look at how slow even a short block like E.4th has taken, and only now its about half way there with the year-late Lola's opening... Cleveland's very conservative when it comes to high-impact/visibility positive development in the city -- unlike how the Crocker's, Legacy's, La Place's and Eton's are thrown up overnight... It's why Corna/Price smirk at big-splash Wolstein across the riv with his big splash/big pol/media event condo project that, going on 2 years later, hasn't turned a spade of dirt (Scott, like late daddy Bart never met a taxpayer cushion he didn't love)...

All I know is that since the 1st time I was (pleasantly) visually assaulted with the eye-catching Stonebridge apts 5 years ago at the foot of the Center swing bridge, I was excited, and had no doubt that the project would continue developing into the mega-compact/high-density mixed use project that it has become.  Is the Price/Corna approach rocket science or an innate gene in local developers to perpetually want to do the wrong thing?

Offline zaceman

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #78 on: September 21, 2006, 07:06:52 AM »
hmm are there any renderings up yet of whats to be built?

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #79 on: September 21, 2006, 07:11:19 AM »
I've not see them, but I will inquire this afternoon. They're supposed to be giving us a press packet, so we'll see what goodies are in there.

And Stark has never said he expects to see his downtown vision built all at once. He fully expects it will take decades to realize. But there needs to be a goal to shoot for, with a number of developers and elected officials lined to participate in achieving that goal. That's what he trying to do.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2006, 07:13:45 AM by KJP »
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Offline 3231

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #80 on: September 21, 2006, 08:00:32 AM »
There is a graphic in the paper. I admit, the footprint for the future phases is not as big as I thought it would be.

Offline gotribe

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #81 on: September 21, 2006, 08:18:04 AM »
There is a graphic in the paper. I admit, the footprint for the future phases is not as big as I thought it would be.
Maybe that means they're going to be tall then. 

Offline 3231

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #82 on: September 21, 2006, 08:31:49 AM »
There is a graphic in the paper. I admit, the footprint for the future phases is not as big as I thought it would be.
Maybe that means they're going to be tall then. 

tall buildings next to parking lots don't make for a quaint neighborhood

Offline zaceman

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #83 on: September 21, 2006, 08:35:18 AM »
id say anything within 20 stories is ok.  plus there is an area where theres parking lots, and then theres an area where theres a lot of other smaller buildings further away from the river.  i'm hoping to see re-use and add-ons in the area where things are already built. 

Offline 3231

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #84 on: September 21, 2006, 08:54:31 AM »
here's today's graphic from the PD:

« Last Edit: February 25, 2010, 05:56:10 PM by Mildtraumatic »

Offline urbanlife

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #85 on: September 21, 2006, 09:05:03 AM »
looks like lots of interior windows. 

tall and thin, with views from all rooms, please please please. 
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Offline 8ShadesofGray

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #86 on: September 21, 2006, 09:11:13 AM »
Long term, I think it will be interesting to see how upscale Stonebridge interacts with the almost adjacent public housing. Certainly not saying it won't work, as Ohio City and Tremont have enjoyed healthy housing values/retail starts in relative proximity to public housing, and I certainly hope it will work. Just think it's an interesting dynamic to have these footprints basically touching at about Mulberry and 25th.

Offline Map Boy

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #87 on: September 21, 2006, 09:11:24 AM »
We'll know more at the end of the day, but I'll say that I've been a tad concerned about the focus on Main Ave when the glut of surface parking is closer to the river and Powerhouse.  This could be a strategic move, leaving those spots for potential casino construction, but either way, there's no doubt in my mind that if this project continues to be successful, that it will spawn more development surrounding whatever footprint they've already laid out.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #88 on: September 21, 2006, 12:14:15 PM »
I received the press packet at the office this morning, and there is a detailed 11x17-inch diagram of the proposed development, including phasing. It looks like one of the block-sized parking areas (next to Main Avenue and Center Street) would be structured parking. I will have to verify that this evening. There also are a lot of streetscape features (walkways, promenades, etc) shown beyond the area of the new buildings shown in the PD graphic of the new buildings.

I won't be able to scan the image until later this evening, however. And since it is 11x17, I will have to scan in it sections so the details can be seen better.
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Offline Map Boy

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #89 on: September 21, 2006, 12:30:20 PM »
Looking forward to it!

Offline oallostavros

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #90 on: September 21, 2006, 01:42:52 PM »
The view?

Offline clvlndr

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #91 on: September 21, 2006, 07:54:58 PM »
And Stark has never said he expects to see his downtown vision built all at once. He fully expects it will take decades to realize. But there needs to be a goal to shoot for, with a number of developers and elected officials lined to participate in achieving that goal. That's what he trying to do.

Agreed.  I was unfair to lump Stark in with the others because the man has a vision and a creative plan for private individuals to buy in to his plan.  I just hope he can get some new establishments up 'n running piecemeal, like K&D have so brilliantly done with Stonebridge, and how the Avenue District is approaching it's highly worthwhile project.

Offline 3231

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #92 on: September 21, 2006, 09:42:12 PM »
I stopped by the ceremony today.  They had a huge model and a bunch of posters with the future developments. Cool, but not as extensive as I thought. I can't help but think that I'd rather have this go somewhere in downtown.  While this could be very cool, its spin-off effect would not be as powerful as if it were in downtown.

I think that the casino vote will have a big impact on the shape of the west bank.  Center St. is the main corridor. There will be some townhomes along the Cuyahoga just south/west of the Center St. Bridge. Also, another building would go just behind the existing stonebridge office building on the empty lot.  From there, the development will stretch north on Center.  The massings weren't that great. They looked very ColumbusDowntown-esque--all glassy and suburban officeparkish.  But, they obviously are just massings.

Sorry, I didn't have my camera with me.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #93 on: September 21, 2006, 10:49:14 PM »
Here's a graphic of the proposed Flats West Bank project (scroll right to see the whole thing)........

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Offline audidave

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #94 on: September 22, 2006, 12:45:59 AM »
All the phases make sense to me until 10,11, and 12.  To me it suggests really high land values to place tall towers there.  Must be based on a casino coming in.

Offline urbanlife

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #95 on: September 22, 2006, 06:33:25 AM »
it seems that they also have to be careful not to block views from existing for sale units. 

were there massings or any indication on phases 9-12?
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Offline Map Boy

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #96 on: September 22, 2006, 09:19:44 AM »
I ended up not making this event because I was bogged down in work for my real estate investment course...oh the irony!  So, sorry, but no pictures from me...
« Last Edit: September 22, 2006, 09:20:09 AM by Mister Good Day »

Offline 3231

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #97 on: September 22, 2006, 10:14:09 AM »
From what I could gather from the massings, the buildings wouldn't block each other's views. All the new phases would be connected by glass walkways (?). 

Offline gotribe

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #98 on: September 22, 2006, 10:33:56 AM »
^Exactly.  The development seems to be a little bit Florida resort townish. 

Offline zaceman

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #99 on: September 22, 2006, 10:42:21 AM »
do they reuse existing buildings on these sites?  the cluster of 1200 units + 600,000+ office retail has existing structures there and one of them.  also i wonder how tall these things will be, does anyone have any more pictures?? 

Offline blinker12

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #100 on: September 22, 2006, 10:55:52 AM »
Ew, glass walkways? What the heck are they doing that for if, as they say, they want the neighborhood to be pedestrian-friendly and lively?

Offline jamiec

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #101 on: September 22, 2006, 11:04:22 AM »
.........and suddenly, the tide changed. hahaha

Offline urbanlife

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #102 on: September 22, 2006, 11:19:32 AM »
so what was the real reason for press conference?  it almost seems like they are doing this as a favor to support the "believe in cleveland" sort of mentality.  and although they have had these phases in mind for some time, why announce something at this point about the future. 

now, when phase 12 doesn't happen, in 15 years someone will say, "there were supposed to be buildings here."

was there any overarching purpose (additional investment partners needed, hoping to start drwaing interest for the retail space)?
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Offline 3231

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #103 on: September 22, 2006, 11:26:10 AM »
so what was the real reason for press conference?  it almost seems like they are doing this as a favor to support the "believe in cleveland" sort of mentality.  and although they have had these phases in mind for some time, why announce something at this point about the future. 

now, when phase 12 doesn't happen, in 15 years someone will say, "there were supposed to be buildings here."

was there any overarching purpose (additional investment partners needed, hoping to start drwaing interest for the retail space)?

I think that it makes a lot of sense. It helps build excitement and create a buzz that something great is going to happen here. That helps sell units. I would be more likely to consider Stonebridge knowing that it will be a growing neighborhood. If the current construction were to be the last building, I wouldn't consider it as much.

Offline 8ShadesofGray

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Re: Cleveland: Stonebridge/Flats West development
« Reply #104 on: September 22, 2006, 11:40:13 AM »
I also appreciate getting to see the public space improvements they want made, particularly since it sounds like they're hoping to establish a TIF. Rather than focusing on the need for public funding solely because the project will have an economic impact, they are also showing direct benefits from public investment: better accessibility between the East Flats and the West Flats, as well as FAR better access to Whiskey Island.

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