Author Topic: Cleveland sidewalks  (Read 2863 times)

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Offline KJP

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Cleveland sidewalks
« on: August 30, 2018, 08:55:46 PM »
As a general rule, sidewalks in Cleveland suck....

Residents fed up with dangerous deformed sidewalk, say it feels as though they live in 'lost zone'
https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/cleveland-metro/residents-fed-up-with-dangerous-deformed-sidewalk-say-it-feels-as-though-they-live-in-lost-zone
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Offline PoshSteve

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2018, 08:17:00 PM »
That's pretty terrible disrepair there, but I hope their solution isn't completely removing that tree.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2018, 08:34:24 PM »
There's a few unwalkable (and thus, not ADA accessible) sidewalks along the streets a few blocks inside Cleveland, just east of my home. It's a stark contrast to the well-maintained sidewalks here in Lakewood, where protruding corners are grinded down and cracked shale sidewalks are replaced.

I regularly take walks around my neighborhood so I'm tempted to do a photo comparison of Lakewood vs Cleveland.
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Offline Cavalier Attitude

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2018, 02:29:41 PM »
At least it seems like they're repairing some of them. The various stretches of Detroit that are under construction right now. Also W 69th Street north of Detroit, of which the upper half was one of the worst sections of road and sidewalk in the city. Work on the portion from Herman to Father Caruso is underway, and the portion from Detroit to Herman will be done in the spring.

Offline Cleburger

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2018, 02:59:33 PM »
My personal favorite is when the City of Cleveland goes in and installs ADA ramps at crossing--but the sidewalks just beyond them are non-navigable by a wheelchair!  It's no wonder you see so many folks riding their wheelchairs in the streets.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2018, 09:40:49 AM »
How about some illumination along the sidewalks??

@downtownercast
Boulevard of Broken Streetlights... On Prospect Ave. between Superior and Ontario, there are 29 streetlights. Only 13 of them are working. What’s up with that?

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Offline X

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2018, 01:33:15 PM »
They seem to be doing a lot of work along that stretch of Prospect.  It might have something to do with that.

Offline westlake10

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2018, 04:03:31 PM »
That's pretty terrible disrepair there, but I hope their solution isn't completely removing that tree.

This is classic urbanohio... there is no solution that doesn't conflict with the "keep things the way they are" crowd

Offline jmicha

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2018, 04:09:46 PM »
That's pretty terrible disrepair there, but I hope their solution isn't completely removing that tree.

This is classic urbanohio... there is no solution that doesn't conflict with the "keep things the way they are" crowd

How is not wanting to lose a mature street tree, a valuable asset in urban areas, a sign of wanting to "keep things the way they are?" That statement is baffling to me.

You can rebuild sidewalks to deal with decades of root growth. It happens all over the planet. It's not rocket science.

Offline Mildtraumatic

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2018, 04:19:59 PM »
It seems they have to fix the streets before sidewalks. Hopefully taxpayers that are moving downtown and UC will spread outwards to generate Rev. One thing I've always noticed when I was child was how clean Columbus streets were in appearance to Cleveland's and wondered why. Even though I love Cleveland then and now when I made my weekend visits to my Fathers I would make fun at my Brother how Columbus is a sissy clean city while Cleveland was hard core tough city. Never-the-less  I do think a condition of a cities streets and sidewalks makes a lasting impression on a person. A much stronger unconscious impression than I think many realize except for people in here. Back then going into Columbus I would think, wow the freeways blacktop actually look black! At the time I didn't think of Cleveland's rough winters and always having salt on them though. Final thought, what a city's streets look like may be a visitors first and "lasting" impression of how they view a city.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2018, 04:44:50 PM by Mildtraumatic »

Offline jeremyck01

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2018, 02:32:08 AM »


This is classic urbanohio... there is no solution that doesn't conflict with the "keep things the way they are" crowd

This is classic Westlake10. Only 11 posts on Urban Ohio and most of them used to insult long time forum members or scoff at the idea of, you know, urban. Why did you join the forum if you have nothing to offer?

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2018, 09:40:25 AM »
Because Westlake, thanks to Crocker Park, is now the epicenter of urbanity in Northeast Ohio!

Back to sidewalks, X is correct about the city doing some work along Prospect. But it is classic Cleveland -- no attention to detail especially when pedestrians are concerned. You can't even walk safely (or move at all if you're disabled). Note the other side of the street as well, which has the sidewalk completely blocked and no temporary pedestrian passageways provided. Is it really this hard, Cleveland??

"Treat this (November 2018) election as if it's the last election in which you can fully exercise your democratic rights. Because it just might be." -- Margy Waller.

Offline YABO713

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2018, 10:31:44 AM »
^Personal injury attorneys are probably set up in a nearby building with binoculars.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2018, 11:01:33 AM »
^Personal injury attorneys are probably set up in a nearby building with binoculars.

Oh we don't have any of those in Cleveland...
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Offline Clefan98

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2018, 12:37:25 PM »
This is the third time our streets have been swept and cleaned this year alone.  From 2012-2017 it happened exactly one time. I've also noticed that most of our bad sidewalks have been replaced this year as well.  I run/walk my dog ALL over OC and DS daily, so i just wanted you all to know what I'm observing. 

The city services are improving due to the tax increase and high income earners moving back to the city.  I hope that many you who complain, yet don't live in the city proper, will move consider moving here to add to the tax base and help improve the city even more.  I do not mean this as dig...I know everyone here voices their opinion because they care and want better. 

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2018, 12:43:07 PM »
Could you tell those service workers to come out to Edgewater sometime soon and fix the sidewalks out here? I work in Cleveland but until the police response time and schools dramatically improve, I cannot live in the city (or afford private schools or subject my son to a religious institution). And because I live only three blocks from Cleveland, a substantial portion of my shopping, dining and, yes walking on sidewalks that look like an earthquake shattered them, is done in Cleveland.
"Treat this (November 2018) election as if it's the last election in which you can fully exercise your democratic rights. Because it just might be." -- Margy Waller.

Offline Clefan98

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2018, 12:51:56 PM »
Well it's a chicken and the egg situation.  The schools will not improve if everyone is afraid to send their kids to them.  Same goes for sidewalk and street repair.  The city can only do so much with it's limited resources, so it's going to take time to fix everything in all wards.  More tax paying residents will speed up the process.

Offline Clefan98

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2018, 12:58:38 PM »
BTW my daughter graduated from a CMSD public HS with a 4.0 and is now a frosh at CSU.

Offline Cleburger

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2018, 01:49:42 PM »
Well it's a chicken and the egg situation.  The schools will not improve if everyone is afraid to send their kids to them.  Same goes for sidewalk and street repair.  The city can only do so much with it's limited resources, so it's going to take time to fix everything in all wards.  More tax paying residents will speed up the process.

They can also certainly be more efficient with their resources.  I know a couple of people who work for the City and they joke about what a colossal glut of time clock whores work there doing nothing--in every department. 

Offline Clefan98

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2018, 01:54:36 PM »
Well it's a chicken and the egg situation.  The schools will not improve if everyone is afraid to send their kids to them.  Same goes for sidewalk and street repair.  The city can only do so much with it's limited resources, so it's going to take time to fix everything in all wards.  More tax paying residents will speed up the process.

They can also certainly be more efficient with their resources.  I know a couple of people who work for the City and they joke about what a colossal glut of time clock whores work there doing nothing--in every department. 

Absolutely true as well.  I'm confident if we elect a competent leader things will change inside city hall.  But that takes people living inside of the city limits to care and vote. So yeah, chicken and the egg again.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #20 on: September 14, 2018, 02:25:45 PM »
Chicken/egg doesn't apply. Just as investors fund success and not need, people will live in Cleveland when it provides comparable/competitive services/schools. Where they live will be the biggest investment of their lives.
"Treat this (November 2018) election as if it's the last election in which you can fully exercise your democratic rights. Because it just might be." -- Margy Waller.

Online Enginerd

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #21 on: September 14, 2018, 02:32:26 PM »
Chicken/egg doesn't apply. Just as investors fund success and not need, people will live in Cleveland when it provides comparable/competitive services/schools. Where they live will be the biggest investment of their lives.

Specifically regarding CMSD, the “chicken and the egg” is the whole reason the Ohio Supreme Court rules school funding unconstitutional what, 20 years ago? Poverty stricken districts with many disadvantaged students have continued since then to poorly perform.

But, I suppose Cleveland needs to work with the system we’re stuck with to try and improve in any way they can since Columbus won’t help.

But otherwise I completely agree with you, and this is coming from a Cleveland resident.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2018, 02:35:26 PM by Enginerd »

Offline Clefan98

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #22 on: September 14, 2018, 02:35:29 PM »
^^ we'll just have to agree to disagree.  If there weren't a need, there wouldn't be investors. I believe we're both half right..Regardless, my original point was that i've lived in the city for 7 yrs and there's been more improvements made this year than in the prior 6yrs combined.  PM me if you'd like to meet up and see proof of my claims.  I knew I'd take heat for giving the city an ounce of credit...\

I also lived in Lakewood for two years.  It's not all roses living there either.  I had to call the cops more there than I have thus far in DS.  To be fair, I did live right next to a bar.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2018, 02:41:06 PM by Clefan98 »

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #23 on: September 14, 2018, 06:04:40 PM »
The city does deserve an ounce of credit. Maybe even two. ;) It's improved from a dumpster fire to an average city, with below-average and above-average areas. It is finally able to attract outsiders, especially from other cities who don't yet look so closely at all of the cracks in a sidewalk to see the bigger picture.

On the subject of sidewalks/Lakewood... My city spent this summer grinding down protruding edges on sidewalks and replacing others. It's the third time they've done that in my neighborhood since I moved to it 22 years ago. Haven't seen them touch Edgewater sidewalks in that time period, except along Clifton that got a $20 million rebuild in 2014-15. In my 51 years, Edgewater was always the Cleveland neighborhood where the city officials lived so it was usually better maintained than most neighborhoods. And it still didn't and doesn't measure up to Lakewood. I call the cops in my neighborhood maybe once every year or three. It's nice having a whole cavalry of police cars show up in less than two minutes of your phone call, isn't it?
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Offline carnevalem

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #24 on: September 14, 2018, 06:11:56 PM »
Because Westlake, thanks to Crocker Park, is now the epicenter of urbanity in Northeast Ohio!

Back to sidewalks, X is correct about the city doing some work along Prospect. But it is classic Cleveland -- no attention to detail especially when pedestrians are concerned. You can't even walk safely (or move at all if you're disabled). Note the other side of the street as well, which has the sidewalk completely blocked and no temporary pedestrian passageways provided. Is it really this hard, Cleveland??



Could a motivated organization sue the city for ADA violations (or at least threaten to) for stuff like this? They could document all the locations in the city that aren't safe  according to ADA and demand a plan to fix it, or else they'd unleash an avalanche of legal challenges.

Offline PoshSteve

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2018, 10:01:11 PM »
For whatever reason I thought the city was the responsible party for repairing sidewalks in Cleveland. Did some light digging and it's actually the property owner who is responsible for any repairs. This makes more sense to me, as that is the case in most cities it seems. So this may be the root cause of why so many are in such disrepair (and why the better neighborhoods seem to have better sidewalks). Homeowners just don't have the money or the care to repair damaged blocks. The city does apparently have a 50/50 program to help low income residents with repairs, though funds are limited each year. Certainly the city could do a much better job with code enforcement in all areas, and particularly sidewalks.

Here is the city's sidewalk fact sheet:
http://www.city.cleveland.oh.us/sites/default/files/forms_publications/SidewalkFactSheet.pdf

Offline metrocity

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2018, 10:30:46 PM »
I was in Cleveland over labor day weekend, and did notice that they weirdly just close off sidewalks for construction projects, and the only option is to cross the street. No protected areas to walk around it using the street. There was a lot Downtown. It was especially annoying coming off the Red Line at Little Italy where you are pretty much forced to jaywalk across Mayfield to continue into Little Italy. To legally use a crosswalk would send you the opposite way toward Euclid Ave.

In Chicago, it seems more the norm to have a devoloper provide safe ped access around a construction site on the same side of the street...especially Downtown. They place Jersey barriers around the path into the street.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2018, 10:36:27 PM by metrocity »

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2018, 10:40:04 PM »
For whatever reason I thought the city was the responsible party for repairing sidewalks in Cleveland. Did some light digging and it's actually the property owner who is responsible for any repairs.

However the city typically initiates sidewalk improvements and then bills the property owner.
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Offline PoshSteve

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #28 on: September 15, 2018, 04:37:53 PM »
For whatever reason I thought the city was the responsible party for repairing sidewalks in Cleveland. Did some light digging and it's actually the property owner who is responsible for any repairs.

However the city typically initiates sidewalk improvements and then bills the property owner.

Its my understanding that the city doing sidewalk work themselves (and billing or not billing the owner) is pretty atypical. In South Euclid the city doesn't replace sidewalk blocks, its all up to the homeowner. We will issue a citation for code violations if its seen to be cracked of unlevel, at which point the property owner is responsible for repairing it. For senior and low income owners though, grants are available for any code violation repairs, including sidewalks. Shaker Hts is pretty much exactly the same, only with the option of hiring a contractor through the city, where the city will bill you instead.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland sidewalks
« Reply #29 on: September 15, 2018, 05:06:17 PM »
"Treat this (November 2018) election as if it's the last election in which you can fully exercise your democratic rights. Because it just might be." -- Margy Waller.