Author Topic: Electric Scooter Sharing  (Read 5599 times)

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Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #60 on: July 30, 2018, 12:00:04 PM »
Ack! I hope you heal quickly, even though you did add another fear to my list of irrational fears. "the disks would slide into you like a pizza slicer"



All of the emphasis on helmets and car collisions ignores all of the other exciting injuries that you can sustain.  Also, wearing sandals or the wrong type of shoes while riding a bike or a scooter is so dumb I don't even know what to say.  I think a lot of the injuries that people sustain on these scooters will stem from wearing sandals, dress shoes, etc. 
 


Offline jwulsin

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #61 on: July 31, 2018, 02:50:38 PM »
I had ridden Bird scooters in other, less hilly cities... but I wasn't sure how they'd handle Cincinnati's big hills. So, out of curiosity, I just rode a Bird scooter up Vine St hill, from Findlay Market. I specifically chose a scooter with a full battery because I was afraid it wouldn't make it up the hill. I started at Findlay Market with nearly 100% battery. At the top of Vine St (at McMillan), I had drained a bit less than 20% of the battery, which is actually much better performance than I had anticipated. The motor didn't seem to "struggle" at all going up the Vine hill. The speed was definitely faster than if I'd tried to bike, and - of course - I didn't break a sweat.

I'm convinced. Especially in a hilly city like Cincinnati, we should design our streets to safely accommodate bikes and scooters, and we should design proper storage facilities and rules for where to park them. I don't really care whether they're owned by companies like Bird, or a public entity (a la Red Bike), or simply through private ownership.

Offline jjakucyk

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #62 on: July 31, 2018, 04:27:52 PM »
...I just rode a Bird scooter up Vine St hill, from Findlay Market.

One of the logistical issues with dockless transport that I'm curious about is when someone takes a bike/scooter/whatever out of their normal range.  I know Bird has "nests" where the scooters are deployed each/most mornings after they've been charged by their indy contractors/bounty hunters overnight.  So on an aggregate level, they're redistributed around to where they're needed.  But if you take one way out into the boonies, relatively speaking, unless you keep it checked out while at your destination, someone else could check it out or take it away for charging, then you're effectively stranded without a way to get back.  Is this a common issue, or how is it dealt with?

Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #63 on: July 31, 2018, 04:49:18 PM »
  But if you take one way out into the boonies, relatively speaking, unless you keep it checked out while at your destination, someone else could check it out or take it away for charging, then you're effectively stranded without a way to get back.  Is this a common issue, or how is it dealt with?

On Saturday I saw an unusual number of people red biking down Vine and Clifton around 10pm.  I imagine that a number of them rode Bird scooters uphill to the FC game and then got back via red bike. 

Offline jwulsin

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #64 on: July 31, 2018, 04:58:49 PM »
  But if you take one way out into the boonies, relatively speaking, unless you keep it checked out while at your destination, someone else could check it out or take it away for charging, then you're effectively stranded without a way to get back.  Is this a common issue, or how is it dealt with?

On Saturday I saw an unusual number of people red biking down Vine and Clifton around 10pm.  I imagine that a number of them rode Bird scooters uphill to the FC game and then got back via red bike. 
That is a great idea.

Offline jwulsin

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #65 on: July 31, 2018, 05:04:32 PM »
...I just rode a Bird scooter up Vine St hill, from Findlay Market.

One of the logistical issues with dockless transport that I'm curious about is when someone takes a bike/scooter/whatever out of their normal range.  I know Bird has "nests" where the scooters are deployed each/most mornings after they've been charged by their indy contractors/bounty hunters overnight.  So on an aggregate level, they're redistributed around to where they're needed.  But if you take one way out into the boonies, relatively speaking, unless you keep it checked out while at your destination, someone else could check it out or take it away for charging, then you're effectively stranded without a way to get back.  Is this a common issue, or how is it dealt with?
In DC, they have areas/neighborhoods where you're not allowed to park it. I don't see that here in Cincy. My guess is that Bird is taking a "wait and see" approach before limiting it to specific neighborhoods. In your example, you certainly can't guarantee that a specific scooter/bike will be available for you for a "return" trip. Until a critical mass is available, scooters will be part of a multi-modal trip (scoot one way, and then walk/bike/uber/bus/scoot back).

Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #66 on: July 31, 2018, 05:12:01 PM »
That is a great idea.

I was very skeptical of the traditional bikeshare in Cincinnati because of the weight of the bikes and the hills.  Electric bikeshare will probably do better.  But my central beef with bikeshare will still exist -- that the one-size-fits-all frame is a total pain to ride, if not dangerous. 

The electric scooters avoid the frame issue more or less entirely, which is a major advantage, but the things will always have a limited range compared to electric bikes.  Both suffer from the inappropriate footwear issue.  On Saturday I saw a girl lose her sandal out in the middle of the Schwartz's Point intersection, and almost fell off the bike since she had to catch herself with her bare heal.  There is no way to stop people from doing knucklehead stuff like that on the scooters, either. 








Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #67 on: July 31, 2018, 10:41:40 PM »
Lime Scooters Now Available in Columbus

A second rentable scooter option is now available in Columbus. Lime, the company that deployed its dockless bicycles earlier this summer in Linden, Clintonville and the South Side, placed a number of its electric scooters in those same neighborhoods on Sunday. As of earlier today, though, dozens of the scooters were available to rent Downtown as well.

The arrival of the new Lime scooters comes just a few weeks after the launch of Bird in Columbus. The Bird scooters were initially placed Downtown (including the Area District), in the Short North and in Bexley. The city of Bexley, however, removed the scooters, citing legal questions raised by Bird’s business model.

More below:
https://www.columbusunderground.com/lime-scooters-now-available-in-columbus-bw1

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Offline DarkandStormy

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #68 on: August 01, 2018, 09:13:32 AM »
These are pretty fun.  Not sure how often I'll use without a promo/discount code (PM me for either Lime or Bird if anyone wants one).  I can see the benefit for some, but also I can see the downsides.  Hopefully more options out there that are successful pushes other transportation options as well.

Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #69 on: August 04, 2018, 05:09:56 PM »
I did an impromptu 3-4 mile ride on one today...I spotted one in front of Murphy's Pub.  The front handlebars were wobbly and the rear brake was terrible.  It was very unstable going downhill (I rode from Warner St. down W. Clifton to OTR).  Could not go up Ravine St. between Central Parkway and McMicken, a distance of one block.  It was fine on level ground but the ride can be a little twitchy.  For the first time I noticed that there are a few manholes in the bike lanes on Central Parkway. 

I totally drained the battery trying to ride up W. Clifton into Clifton Heights (47% to 3%).  Herein lies the whole problem with these scooters...they're not powerful enough to go up one of Cincinnati's hills twice on one charge.  So the scooters are getting up into Clifton Heights, Mt. Auburn, etc., but then they're basically shot for the day.  So it's basically a Bird paradise up until about noon for OTR residents, then it's helplessly spotty.  I'm not sure a rollout of these scooters near UC could really work because the batteries would be drained so quickly.

I think a higher quality scooter that one actually owns could work for a lot of urban dwellers, except the Birds are too heavy to easily carry up steps, so they'd need parking on the first floor of a building.  They take up less space than a bike, though.  The problem is locking them at a destination, they would no doubt be a tempting target for thieves. 


Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #70 on: August 06, 2018, 01:32:48 PM »
Also, I didn't account for the fact that the scooters can probably go up these hills for most women and especially those who weigh around 110-120lbs but not most men.  So the scooters might be getting up the hills early in the morning because girls are riding them, but I have yet to actually see this happen. 

In other news, Bird has announced tentative plans to pay for bike/scooter lanes in some cities.  So in exchange for striping the lanes, will they get to paint their own advertising on the pavement, put up their own signs, etc.?

Offline taestell

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #71 on: August 06, 2018, 02:02:37 PM »
Glad to see that they're funding bike lanes. But the reason bike lanes aren't being built in Cincinnati isn't because of lack of funding... it's because our current administration refuses to allow them to be built.

Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #72 on: August 08, 2018, 04:14:26 PM »
Electric scooters on collision course with pedestrians, lawmakers

Electric scooters are appearing in many major cities across the country – including Cincinnati – bringing fun to riders, profits to scooter makers and lots of potential risks to walkers and riders.

San Diego, where I live, is at the forefront of the proliferation of electric rideables. As a physical activity researcher I am an interested observer. Recently, I was enjoying a stroll on the boardwalk when a couple of electric scooters zoomed past. As I saw a young girl start walking across the boardwalk, another scooter zipped by, and I could tell it would not be able to stop in time. The young woman riding the scooter was able to act quickly. Instead of crashing into the girl at full speed, she fell down with the scooter and slid to a stop. There was a crash and minor injuries to the rider, but a tragedy was avoided.

I consider this event a warning about the dangers posed by the electric vehicles that have rapidly become commonplace on local boardwalks and sidewalks. An online search will reveal many reports of injuries. A Dallas woman went to the emergency room for head injuries the week of July 9, and officials in Nashville are considering legislation there that would require registration for scooters.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/08/08/commentary-electric-scooters-on-collision-course.html

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Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #73 on: August 08, 2018, 04:15:12 PM »
Kevin Wright engages in guerrilla campaign to get Cincinnati to accept scooters

The head of an urban growth firm is launching a guerrilla-style experiment in hopes of getting Cincinnati to embrace the new Bird electric scooters without encountering the same pitfalls that have led other cities to ban them.

Guerrilla Bird Cages are meant to suggest where people can park the electric scooters.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/08/08/exclusive-kevin-wright-engages-in-guerrilla.html

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Offline surfohio

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #74 on: August 08, 2018, 04:20:47 PM »
Electric scooters on collision course with pedestrians, lawmakers

Electric scooters are appearing in many major cities across the country – including Cincinnati – bringing fun to riders, profits to scooter makers and lots of potential risks to walkers and riders.

San Diego, where I live, is at the forefront of the proliferation of electric rideables. As a physical activity researcher I am an interested observer. Recently, I was enjoying a stroll on the boardwalk when a couple of electric scooters zoomed past. As I saw a young girl start walking across the boardwalk, another scooter zipped by, and I could tell it would not be able to stop in time. The young woman riding the scooter was able to act quickly. Instead of crashing into the girl at full speed, she fell down with the scooter and slid to a stop. There was a crash and minor injuries to the rider, but a tragedy was avoided.

I consider this event a warning about the dangers posed by the electric vehicles that have rapidly become commonplace on local boardwalks and sidewalks. An online search will reveal many reports of injuries. A Dallas woman went to the emergency room for head injuries the week of July 9, and officials in Nashville are considering legislation there that would require registration for scooters.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/08/08/commentary-electric-scooters-on-collision-course.html

Okay I also live in SD and yes the Bird's are everywhere. But I haven't seen any scooter accidents. Not one. Albeit I'm not a licensed "Physical Activity Researcher" I'm just a normal idiot.

However I have seen about a thousand car accidents.

Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #75 on: August 08, 2018, 08:01:10 PM »
Is it even theoretically possible to build a self-driving scooter?  If so, the nearest scooter could drive to you when you want to use one, and then when you're done, drive away and park itself in an appropriate spot. 

A driverless tricycle would definitely be possible.  Something like this could come to you:

Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #76 on: August 08, 2018, 10:56:47 PM »
City strikes a deal to allow Bird scooters for now

The city of Cincinnati issued interim regulations on Wednesday that will cover the dockless electric scooters that have been placed throughout downtown, with the company that operates them, Bird Rides Inc., signing on to at least part of them.

The Bird e-scooters have been on city streets and sidewalks since July 26. The regulations limit the number allowed to 100, unless the city has authorized more. Bird’s mobile app showed more than 100 scooters currently are deployed. Customers can use a GPS-based smartphone app to locate and pay for nearby scooters, which are collected nightly to be recharged and placed at designated areas by 7 a.m. the following day.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/08/08/city-strikes-a-deal-to-allow-bird-scooters-for-now.html
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Offline bumsquare

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Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #78 on: August 11, 2018, 08:15:04 PM »
City increases number of Bird scooters allowed

The city of Cincinnati has upped the number of dockless scooters and other “shared active transportation” options allowed on public sidewalks from a company from 100 to 200.

The move comes a few days after Bird Rides Inc. increased the number of scooters it placed in the basin. It’s believed that there are around 190 scooters currently on the sidewalks.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/08/10/city-increases-number-of-bird-scooters-allowed.html
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Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #79 on: August 12, 2018, 04:59:50 PM »
Today my hunch was verified...all of the scooters that are making their way up to UC are being ridden by women who weigh significantly less than 150lbs. 

So Bird discriminates against men! 

Offline jwulsin

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #80 on: August 13, 2018, 09:09:14 AM »
Today my hunch was verified...all of the scooters that are making their way up to UC are being ridden by women who weigh significantly less than 150lbs. 

So Bird discriminates against men! 
I saw two guys scooting up Vine St hill by Inwood Park on Saturday.

Offline Cygnus

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #81 on: August 13, 2018, 12:23:52 PM »
I tried a Bird Friday afternoon. Within 2 minutes of riding it on the street, a guy speeding his car through a yellow light yelled at me to get on the sidewalk.  ::)  I stayed on the street, but found the small tires on the scooter to be unforgiving of our rough roads. The handle felt as if it was going to come disconnected from the base. Which made me wonder, who's doing the maintenance on these things? And how often?!

I'll stick with my RedBike subscription...
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Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #82 on: August 13, 2018, 02:06:30 PM »
A friend of mine observed that one of the problems with the electric scooters in bike lanes is that they accelerate faster than bicycles but have a lower top speed.  So if a scooter and a bicycle get going at a green light, they pass each other twice.  So this thought that "we just need more bike lanes" isn't the panacea people think it will be.  There is already a huge problem with non-bike activity in bike lanes as well as kids/old people/dogs/rollerbladers on rec trails like the Loveland bike trail. 

Speaking of which, I almost ran over a kid on the Loveland bike trail this past weekend.  A dad was taking a picture of his wife and son on the opposite side of the path, posed with their bikes.  I stop pedaling, he takes the picture, and the damn kid immediately runs across to view it on his phone.  I had to slam on the brakes to keep from hitting this idiot. 

Offline jwulsin

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #83 on: August 13, 2018, 02:38:56 PM »
Comparing Bird and Red Bike (I've been a Red Bike member since it launched), I'm struck by the diversity of people who are using Bird. Relative to Red Bikes, based on what I've seen around OTR, Bird scooters are being used by a much broader demographic (age, race, socio-economics). I don't know how much of that is just due to Bird's novelty, but it's interesting nevertheless. I think of lot of scooting around OTR is "for fun" (I don't mean that derisively) simply because the sensation on an electric scooter is new to almost everyone, and. I don't recall a similar flurry of broad-based usage when Red Bikes launched. I assume a lot of it is due to how easy Bird makes it to sign up, join, and take your first ride. Red Bike feels like more of a financial commitment, even though I suspect many Bird riders will end up spending more per person (on average). 

Offline jjakucyk

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #84 on: August 13, 2018, 03:09:25 PM »
I don't see the slight relative difference in speed and acceleration between bikes and scooters to be much of an issue.  At the most basic level in an urban setting, you can say sidewalks are for <10mph (ped, wheelchairs, rascals, runners), bike lanes for 10-20mph (bikes, scooters, segways), and the roadway for >20mph.  Whatever the actual mode is actually kind of irrelevant.  Now, when you get to roadways with higher speed limits, such as 40MPH and above, then you start getting questions about allowing mopeds in the bike lanes, but we're nowhere near that level yet. 

Offline X

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #85 on: August 13, 2018, 03:36:10 PM »
At 10 mph that's like someone running down the sidewalk at a pretty decent pace (not a sprint, but more than a jog).  I'd say sidewalks should be <5 mph.

Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #86 on: August 13, 2018, 03:47:54 PM »
Influx of scooters across Columbus brings questions of safety, enforcement

As motorized scooters begin to pop up across Columbus, so have concerns about safety and enforcement.

Lime and Bird scooters have been seen on city sidewalks, bicycle and pedestrian trails and, in some cases, are being operated by minors.

And on Monday, Lime announced that its Lime bikes and scooters are being added to Ohio State University's campus, just in time for students returning for the fall semester.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2018/08/13/influx-of-scooters-across-columbusbrings-questions.html
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Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #87 on: August 13, 2018, 04:01:33 PM »
. Red Bike feels like more of a financial commitment, even though I suspect many Bird riders will end up spending more per person (on average). 

The Red Bikes are too expensive and they aren't fun or easy to ride. 


Offline taestell

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #88 on: August 13, 2018, 05:31:52 PM »
I wonder if RedBike will drop their starting price in response to the scooters. The good thing about RedBike's pricing scheme is that they offer an annual pass, though, and there is no per-checkout fee. Bird can get expensive since you're paying an additional dollar every single time you check it out in addition to paying for the additional time.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2018, 07:59:27 PM by taestell »

Offline Ram23

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Re: Electric Scooter Sharing
« Reply #89 on: August 13, 2018, 07:07:39 PM »
^ It's a good pricing strategy for people who use RedBike all the time, but for the casual rider the fares aren't great. I'd probably use it a few times a month if I could get a 30 or 60 minute ride for $1 or $2. Whenever I have the need for something like RedBike, I generally just have a spur of the moment need to go from point A to point B - I don't want a day pass, and I'm not going to pay $8 for a single short trip. If RedBike did start to drop their price to compete with the scooters, I'd probably use them instead of Bird because generally people look goofy on scooters.