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Author Topic: Ohio: General Business & Economic News  (Read 27702 times)

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Offline Clefan98

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1170 on: May 01, 2018, 06:39:34 PM »
If Cleveland's job market is as stagnant as those numbers indicate, which I can believe, property values and rents should be similarly stagnant.

They’re not.

Offline Cleburger

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1171 on: May 01, 2018, 09:07:02 PM »
Good-to-great:

Indianapolis: 116,800 jobs added (12.3%)
Columbus: 135,700 (14.3%)
Raleigh-Durham: 132,600 (16.5%)
Charlotte: 172,500 (16.7%)

Explosive:

Nashville: 196,400 jobs added (24.7%)
Austin: 270,600 (34.3%)

We've had the debate in other threads, but if this doesn't illustrate the economic power of a state capitol, I don't know what does.  5 of the 6 listed here are state government centers.  All those steady paychecks help keep things going in the down times, and help make things sizzle in the good.

Online jmecklenborg

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1172 on: May 01, 2018, 09:43:57 PM »
Good-to-great:

Indianapolis: 116,800 jobs added (12.3%)
Columbus: 135,700 (14.3%)
Raleigh-Durham: 132,600 (16.5%)
Charlotte: 172,500 (16.7%)

Explosive:

Nashville: 196,400 jobs added (24.7%)
Austin: 270,600 (34.3%)

We've had the debate in other threads, but if this doesn't illustrate the economic power of a state capitol, I don't know what does.  5 of the 6 listed here are state government centers.  All those steady paychecks help keep things going in the down times, and help make things sizzle in the good.

The old state capitol excuse.  How's Lansing doing?  Madison?  Springfield?  Topeka?  Lincoln?  St. Paul vs Minneapolis?  Tallahassee?  Harrisburg?  Albany? 

We can go on and on and on. 


Online GCrites80s

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1173 on: May 01, 2018, 09:57:15 PM »
Pierre is really kicking ass

Offline StapHanger

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1174 on: May 01, 2018, 10:13:45 PM »
^Even if we're talking just the city, how much do you know about Austin?

Love Austin. A Progressive Mecca in the heart of Texas, an absolute gem. But, there's still several staunchly conservative districts within the city as incorporated.

Until a couple years ago, their city council elections were at large, so there had literally been zero GOP city council members for a long time. Things changed slightly in 2014, when the city switched to a ward system, but even after that change the council is like 70% Dem. 

Offline jjames0408

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1175 on: May 01, 2018, 11:08:53 PM »
Good-to-great:

Indianapolis: 116,800 jobs added (12.3%)
Columbus: 135,700 (14.3%)
Raleigh-Durham: 132,600 (16.5%)
Charlotte: 172,500 (16.7%)

Explosive:

Nashville: 196,400 jobs added (24.7%)
Austin: 270,600 (34.3%)

We've had the debate in other threads, but if this doesn't illustrate the economic power of a state capitol, I don't know what does.  5 of the 6 listed here are state government centers.  All those steady paychecks help keep things going in the down times, and help make things sizzle in the good.

The old state capitol excuse.  How's Lansing doing?  Madison?  Springfield?  Topeka?  Lincoln?  St. Paul vs Minneapolis?  Tallahassee?  Harrisburg?  Albany? 

We can go on and on and on. 


I don't think it hurts to have a bunch of built-in government jobs, but I think the true differential is timing and a large university. That's were the true growth is happening now. It just so happens that some of the cities it's happening in are also state capitols.

Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1176 on: May 02, 2018, 12:49:05 AM »
Having a large university doesn't necessarily guarantee success.  While Lincoln, Lansing, and Tallahassee are doing fine, I wouldn't exactly put them as stand-outs even with large state universities.  Conversely, Des Moines, Omaha, Kansas City, Grand Rapids, and Indianapolis lack any sort of large university and they are the Midwest's top-class aside from Columbus and Minneapolis.  My metro (Dayton) has a large built-in government employment center (WPAFB) but is still a stagnant metropolitan area. 

Timing, perhaps, is key.  Or not. 
"You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers

Offline E Rocc

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1177 on: May 02, 2018, 07:29:15 AM »
^Even if we're talking just the city, how much do you know about Austin?

Love Austin. A Progressive Mecca in the heart of Texas, an absolute gem. But, there's still several staunchly conservative districts within the city as incorporated.

Austin is Texas's "liberal reservation" and it's become a mecca of sorts for both left libertarians from California and right libertarians from Texas and the south.  A lot of IT people fled there when California started getting really stupid.

The fact that's it's Texas keeps the left's worst impulses in check, the fact that it's Austin the right's.

Offline bjk

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1178 on: May 02, 2018, 08:56:43 AM »
Is it the presence of a large university, or a large university alongside state government?

Offline w28th

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1179 on: May 02, 2018, 09:40:11 AM »
All the "successful" cities from this article lack the historical baggage of transitioning from a large scale industrial economy in the 20th century, and the extreme racial/socio-economic issues that accompanied that situation. I have nothing against them for it (I guess), but rioting and steel mill closures didn't bury Austin or Columbus in the 1960's. Cleveland, Pittsburgh and Detroit are obviously still digging themselves out with varying levels of success.
To me it's not much more complicated than that.

Online GCrites80s

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1180 on: May 02, 2018, 10:32:58 AM »
It's like the minute people see melted-down industrial it kills the cities' appeal to anyone from outside the region... and among a lot of people from inside too.

Online X

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1181 on: May 02, 2018, 03:40:17 PM »
At the very least it means that the net employment numbers of a region are dragged down by losses from industries that are mature of even becoming obsolete.

Offline aderwent

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1182 on: May 06, 2018, 10:34:37 AM »
Using the BLS link posted in another thread, I tallied the jobs numbers for the 3Cs and their closest competitors since March 2008. They seem to fall into four categories: stagnant, fair, good-to-great, and explosive.

Stagnant:

Cleveland: 5,100 jobs added (0.5%)
Pittsburgh: 37,100 (3.3%)

Fair:

Cincinnati: 52,500 jobs added (5.1%)
Kansas City: 78,900 (7.8%)

Good-to-great:

Indianapolis: 116,800 jobs added (12.3%)
Columbus: 135,700 (14.3%)
Raleigh-Durham: 132,600 (16.5%)
Charlotte: 172,500 (16.7%)

Explosive:

Nashville: 196,400 jobs added (24.7%)
Austin: 270,600 (34.3%)

I cherry picked the stats for each of these cities (minus Raleigh-Durham) this morning. I took the recession lows, and the post-recession highs. The only thing that happens is Cleveland passes Pittsburgh and Charlotte is on the fence if not over into the "explosive" group.

City: Low Date - High Date: Jobs Added (%)

Pittsburgh:     February 2010 - November 2017: 108,200 (9.9%)
Cleveland:     January 2010 - June 2017: 103,200 (10.6%)
Cincinnati:     January 2010 - June 2017: 144,700 (15.1%)
Kansas City:  January 2010 - December 2017: 158,500 (16.8%)
Indianapolis: January 2010 - November 2017: 187,300 (21.1%)
Columbus:    January 2010 - December 2017: 196,900 (21.9%)
Charlotte:      July 2009 - December 2017: 270,300 (29.0%)
Nashville:      July 2009 - November 2017: 258,100 (34.8%)
Austin:           July 2009 - March 2018: 296,800 (38.9%)

Offline Matthew67

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1183 on: May 06, 2018, 11:09:15 AM »
Using the BLS link posted in another thread, I tallied the jobs numbers for the 3Cs and their closest competitors since March 2008. They seem to fall into four categories: stagnant, fair, good-to-great, and explosive.

Stagnant:

Cleveland: 5,100 jobs added (0.5%)
Pittsburgh: 37,100 (3.3%)

Fair:

Cincinnati: 52,500 jobs added (5.1%)
Kansas City: 78,900 (7.8%)

Good-to-great:

Indianapolis: 116,800 jobs added (12.3%)
Columbus: 135,700 (14.3%)
Raleigh-Durham: 132,600 (16.5%)
Charlotte: 172,500 (16.7%)

Explosive:

Nashville: 196,400 jobs added (24.7%)
Austin: 270,600 (34.3%)

I cherry picked the stats for each of these cities (minus Raleigh-Durham) this morning. I took the recession lows, and the post-recession highs. The only thing that happens is Cleveland passes Pittsburgh and Charlotte is on the fence if not over into the "explosive" group.

City: Low Date - High Date: Jobs Added (%)

Pittsburgh:     February 2010 - November 2017: 108,200 (9.9%)
Cleveland:     January 2010 - June 2017: 103,200 (10.6%)
Cincinnati:     January 2010 - June 2017: 144,700 (15.1%)
Kansas City:  January 2010 - December 2017: 158,500 (16.8%)
Indianapolis: January 2010 - November 2017: 187,300 (21.1%)
Columbus:    January 2010 - December 2017: 196,900 (21.9%)
Charlotte:      July 2009 - December 2017: 270,300 (29.0%)
Nashville:      July 2009 - November 2017: 258,100 (34.8%)
Austin:           July 2009 - March 2018: 296,800 (38.9%)

What is the percentage? Is it the percentage increase in the total number of jobs in the metro? Do you mean to say that Cleveland had 10.6% more total jobs in June 2017 than in February 2010?

Offline aderwent

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1184 on: May 06, 2018, 11:18:54 AM »

What is the percentage? Is it the percentage increase in the total number of jobs in the metro? Do you mean to say that Cleveland had 10.6% more total jobs in June 2017 than in February 2010?

Correct.

Online jmecklenborg

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1185 on: May 06, 2018, 12:04:23 PM »
Correct.

It's amazing how close the statistics are for Columbus versus Nashville...there are certainly signs of physical growth in Columbus, but in Nashville the sheer number of tower cranes and small infill projects is on a much higher level. 

Offline aderwent

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1186 on: May 06, 2018, 01:46:36 PM »
Correct.

It's amazing how close the statistics are for Columbus versus Nashville...there are certainly signs of physical growth in Columbus, but in Nashville the sheer number of tower cranes and small infill projects is on a much higher level. 

It is pretty frustrating, but they've grown about 50% more than us since 2010; but they grew only 3,000 more than Columbus this past year. So if Columbus keeps that momentum in the coming years we could start to see us approaching their crane levels. And considering we're neither in the South nor a tourist destination, I'd say getting to their level would be quite impressive. We're seeing a flurry of development right now that a lot of is finishing up this year. Once lenders see them get occupied (residential, retail, and commercial) we should see our next flurry of proposals soon. Hopefully this time we'll get some height!

Online jmecklenborg

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1187 on: May 06, 2018, 05:08:45 PM »
They're very different places.  Much of the hi-rise construction in and near DT Nashville is hotels.  The number of infill single-family houses in the in-town neighborhoods is pretty amazing. 

Of course, Nashville lacks a major university.  Vanderbilt is at best a quarter of OSU's size. 

Offline wpcc88

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1188 on: May 06, 2018, 08:01:18 PM »
Correct.

It's amazing how close the statistics are for Columbus versus Nashville...there are certainly signs of physical growth in Columbus, but in Nashville the sheer number of tower cranes and small infill projects is on a much higher level. 

We had 20+ tower cranes up in the past year in the Columbus metro and a good majority of those were downtown or surrounding neighborhoods.  We ARE there at both the tower crane level and the infills in surrounding urban neighborhoods. 

Online KJP

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1189 on: May 09, 2018, 05:02:24 PM »
Didn't know where else to put this. Cutest thing I've seen today (other than my 5-year-old son!).....

"Many Americans are willing to die for their country. But pay taxes for it? No way." -- Me.

Online KJP

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1190 on: June 13, 2018, 07:39:06 PM »
In the Boomer generation, workers went to where employers were located. Now employers (Amazon HQ2's shortlist illustrates the point) are locating where the young, educated workers are, says Joseph Nahas, Jr., of the Counselors of Real Estate. #NAREE18
https://twitter.com/mjarboe/status/1006942800296833024?s=19
"Many Americans are willing to die for their country. But pay taxes for it? No way." -- Me.

Online KJP

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1191 on: June 17, 2018, 11:57:24 AM »
"Many Americans are willing to die for their country. But pay taxes for it? No way." -- Me.

Offline Pugu

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1192 on: June 17, 2018, 12:27:07 PM »
^How very annoying of the PD--couldn't they just use a table?  this isn't clickbait as its all one page----its taking forever to load all those corporate logos.

Offline Pugu

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Re: Ohio: General Business & Economic News
« Reply #1193 on: June 17, 2018, 12:31:41 PM »
If you want a nice clean list---go here:  https://development.ohio.gov/files/research/B2001.pdf

The PD advertising spread is annoying and is STILL loading. Very poor layout planning on behalf of the pd....