Author Topic: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)  (Read 141324 times)

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Offline jim uber

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5700 on: September 07, 2018, 01:02:54 PM »
I don't think it was denied. It was recommended to be denied. The HCB meeting is on the 10th I thought. I'm out of town but if I were here, I'd definitely be attending that meeting and trying my best to channel what Graham Kalbli said (see above post by @ucgrady)

Offline Jimmy Skinner

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5701 on: September 07, 2018, 03:07:15 PM »
^ I just now looked at the HCB packet for 1518 Race, and what is hilarious is the owner of the building to the south is writing to oppose it, when his building is very similar in massing and style.  Talk about NIMYs in glass houses throwing rocks.

Also, Platte looks like they are almost exactly replicating the design aesthetic that they used at 1218 Race, which was approved last year but has not yet begun construction.

https://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/buildings/historic-conservation/historic-conservation-board/september-10-2018-staff-report-and-attachments/

Offline troeros

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5702 on: September 07, 2018, 03:38:32 PM »
There was a hcb meeting today at 10:30 am about the 12th and Sycamore project, any updates on what the board said about the design?

Offline jjakucyk

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5703 on: September 07, 2018, 04:20:53 PM »
I can say nobody around the office who I shared the renderings of 12th and Sycamore with think it's a good looking design.  And this is an architecture firm.  It would actually look just as appropriate in a Mason office park, it's that generic and dated. 

Offline Yves Behar

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5704 on: September 07, 2018, 04:29:51 PM »
You see I thought architects loved this stuff!

Offline troeros

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5705 on: September 07, 2018, 04:52:55 PM »
So it appears from what Iíve learned is that the hcb called for the developers of 12th and sycamore to go back to the drawing boards and involve more community engagement for this project.

I think that this could be a good thing and a good call from the hcb. The current design of this project is quite horrendous tbh for the historic district.

Offline troeros

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5706 on: September 12, 2018, 01:26:21 AM »
So...not to be annoying but anyone hear about the fortus elm and liberty project? Did it die again...?

Offline taestell

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5707 on: September 13, 2018, 03:47:12 PM »
Dos anybody have any information about the Prince of Peace Lutheran Church on Race Street, just south of the Liberty/Race streetcar stop? Scaffolding recently went up, so I assume they're just doing a renovation?

Offline jwulsin

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5708 on: September 14, 2018, 08:27:51 AM »
Dos anybody have any information about the Prince of Peace Lutheran Church on Race Street, just south of the Liberty/Race streetcar stop? Scaffolding recently went up, so I assume they're just doing a renovation?
They wrote in to the HCB in opposition to a few recent projects, so I assume they're not going anywhere.

Offline SleepyLeroy

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5709 on: September 14, 2018, 08:45:14 AM »
Dos anybody have any information about the Prince of Peace Lutheran Church on Race Street, just south of the Liberty/Race streetcar stop? Scaffolding recently went up, so I assume they're just doing a renovation?
They wrote in to the HCB in opposition to a few recent projects, so I assume they're not going anywhere.

I disapprove of their scaffolding, it "towers over the 2-story building next door".

Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5710 on: September 17, 2018, 11:52:30 AM »
Whatís in the final OTR parking plan sent to City Council?

Residential parking permits for Over-the-Rhine south of Liberty Street would cost $60, the city would sell an unlimited number of them and there would be 500 on-street spaces available under a parking plan Acting City Manager Patrick Duhaney sent to City Council on Thursday.

The special parking plan for the neighborhood reverses a previous concept that would have capped the number of permits issued and charged $120 per permit per year. Both versions charge low-income residents in subsidized housing $25 per permit.

But thereís a catch: In the ordinances Duhaney sent council, the city manager would have the authority to raise or lower the price of permits.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/09/14/what-s-in-the-final-otr-parkingplan-sent-to-city.html
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Offline JoeHarmon

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5711 on: September 17, 2018, 03:31:22 PM »
I really wish they weren't voting on both the residential parking permits for OTR and the removal of parking minimums at the same time.  I am afraid those two items will be lumped together.  Removal of parking minimums needs to happen regardless of what happens with residential parking permits.

Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5712 on: September 19, 2018, 11:37:06 AM »
Vote on OTR plan, repeal of parking minimums expected today

The Cincinnati City Council is expected to vote Wednesday on two plans: One would repeal city regulations that require a certain amount of parking spaces for development in downtown and Over-the-Rhine, while the other would set aside a certain number of on-street spaces for OTR residents.

Councilís Zoning Committee, composed of council members Greg Landsman and Amy Murray and Vice Mayor Christopher Smitherman, voted on Tuesday to send both plans to the full council for a potential vote at 2 p.m. today.

The OTR Community Council continues to object to the plan to set aside 500 on-street spaces for neighborhood residents at $60 per year with an unlimited number of passes because the ordinance will allow the city manager to change those amounts without council approval. It also believes the plan has not received enough community input. Today, there are no on-street spaces in OTR set aside for residents. The city has residential parking districts in Clifton, Columbia Tusculum and Pendleton.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/09/19/vote-on-otr-plan-repeal-of-parking-minimums.html
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Offline ColDayMan

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5713 on: September 19, 2018, 09:59:18 PM »
City Council eliminates parking minimums in 3 neighborhoods, passes OTR plan

Developers working in downtown, Over-the-Rhine, Pendleton and adjacent parts of the West End will no longer have to include parking as a part of their projects, the Cincinnati City Council decided in an 8-1 vote on Wednesday.

Council also voted unanimously to set aside 500 on-street spots in Over-the-Rhine for residents, an ordinance opposed by Mayor John Cranley.

The two ordinances have been under discussion for most of the summer, with developers and small businesses pushing for the parking minimum repeal because of a tightening urban core with less room for surface parking lots.

More below:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/09/19/city-council-eliminates-parking-minimums-in-3.html
"You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers

Offline Cincy513

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5714 on: September 20, 2018, 09:21:27 AM »
The elimination of parking minimums is huge for OTR, Pendleton and downtown.  This obviously helps apartment and condo builders but it will also be a great help to restaurants/bars as well.

Do you think an existing restaurant or one that is currently under construction could add space and not have to build/lease more parking? Or since they started/existed before this new rule do they still have to abide by the previous parking minimums?  I remember reading about quite a few places that had to cut down their space because or parking requirements.  Specifically I remember Mikey's Late Night/Oddfellows and Dan Wright's new restaurant both had to downsize due to parking requirements. 
« Last Edit: September 20, 2018, 09:24:40 AM by Cincy513 »

Offline JYP

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5715 on: September 20, 2018, 09:44:23 AM »
Starting October 20th or so, any new project, which would include additions or expansions, will not have to consider the parking regulations. So for most of these, I think the projects are baked from when HCB approved their variances but if they want to expand in the future they will be exempt.

I would have to think the regulatory staff will try to fight for the existing parking requirements right up to the moment this is enacted, they have been against this policy because the current policy allows them to leverage the requirements in exchange for concessions.

While this is a blow to NIMBY's in OTR, it's also a potential blow to the city's ability to stop potentially undesirable projects from moving forward.

What undesirable projects? I don't know, but that was a concern that I heard being raised during this latest push.
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Offline wjh2

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5716 on: September 20, 2018, 09:48:41 AM »
https://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/buildings/historic-conservation/historic-conservation-board/september-24-2018-staff-report-and-attachments/


Latest HCB packet has been uploaded... looks like the former Boys and Girls Club at Liberty/Central (purchased by Fortus Group who is partnering with the elm and liberty project) is going to be demolished and replaced with a parking lot... I am wondering if this is to avoid building the parking garage part of the development?

Disappointing to see as that is a major corner and opportunity for some height and density.

Offline jmicha

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5717 on: September 20, 2018, 09:58:23 AM »
Wow...I really hope that's denied. No parking lots should be allowed to be built anywhere in the core, let alone ones of that scale on prominent corners. That's horrible.

Offline 1400 Sycamore

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5718 on: September 20, 2018, 10:15:02 AM »
I find it hilarious that so many here talk about these projects as though they are some type of super race whose opinions are more important than those of the persons who actually own the land and pay for the development and live with the results. Kind of a nerd elitism.

Offline savadams13

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5719 on: September 20, 2018, 10:47:55 AM »
Sorry but this is the shit that happens when Margy and her crew of OTRCC get involved. They piss off developers so much they find ways around doing what they want because of the unreasonable amount of demands. This parking lot is a big f*** you to the community for dragging out this process as long as they did with so many meetings and hearings. We are seeing the NIMBY crowd winning more and more and this is creating shitty projects from OTR to Oakley.

Offline jwulsin

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5720 on: September 20, 2018, 10:54:35 AM »
I find it hilarious that so many here talk about these projects as though they are some type of super race whose opinions are more important than those of the persons who actually own the land and pay for the development and live with the results. Kind of a nerd elitism.
Nobody here is claiming to be a "super race". This is a community forum for sharing ideas and opinions. If you don't want to read other people's opinions, you are certainly welcome to not read them!

Offline Cincy513

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5721 on: September 20, 2018, 10:54:41 AM »
Not to mention they seemingly killed the Liberty and Elm project.  The OTRCC is not a positive for the neighborhood. 

Offline JYP

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5722 on: September 20, 2018, 11:01:01 AM »
https://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/buildings/historic-conservation/historic-conservation-board/september-24-2018-staff-report-and-attachments/


Latest HCB packet has been uploaded... looks like the former Boys and Girls Club at Liberty/Central (purchased by Fortus Group who is partnering with the elm and liberty project) is going to be demolished and replaced with a parking lot... I am wondering if this is to avoid building the parking garage part of the development?

Disappointing to see as that is a major corner and opportunity for some height and density.

I would speculate the parking lot is more a condition of getting financing for the development. If you look at the report, they are preparing to build the parking lot into a garage in a future phase. My guess is this:

1.) Demo the building for a temporary surface lot/staging area to secure financing for the approved plan.
2.) Phase 2 will be a structured garage as designated in the approved parking lot for Liberty and Elm, with a new mixed-use building fronting Central Parkway.
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Offline jwulsin

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5723 on: September 20, 2018, 11:12:40 AM »
Does anybody have a copy of the latest site plan for the Liberty/Elm project?

Offline jjakucyk

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5724 on: September 20, 2018, 11:14:26 AM »
I find it hilarious that so many here talk about these projects as though they are some type of super race whose opinions are more important than those of the persons who actually own the land and pay for the development and live with the results. Kind of a nerd elitism.

Hey guess what?  When buildings in the core are torn down and replaced with parking lots, it's the rest of us who end up subsidizing that property owner.  The streets, sidewalks, pipes, wires, lights, police, fire, schools, libraries...those don't go away when a building is demolished, but they still have to be operated and maintained.  The property owner however has their taxes reduced to a pittance.  So the burden of all that infrastructure and services falls on the rest of us to cover through our taxes and utility rates.  So yeah, we have every right to be upset when projects get scaled down, canceled, or turned into vacant lots (which parking lots are too).  Your self-righteousness is misplaced and ignorant.

Offline jim uber

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5725 on: September 20, 2018, 11:32:11 AM »
Not to mention they seemingly killed the Liberty and Elm project.  The OTRCC is not a positive for the neighborhood. 
This quote from the CoA review for the proposed Lot seems to indicate otherwise: "The proposed parking lot will be built in association with the previously approved development at the northwest corner of Liberty Street and Elm Street. Under common ownership, the lot will likely initially serve as public parking until the parking lot is needed for the development. Upon completion of the building, the lot will serve the residents of the Liberty and Elm residences. Eventually, a parking garage is intended to serve the development at which point the subject property could be redeveloped to commercial or mixed-use."

Offline jjakucyk

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5726 on: September 20, 2018, 11:36:57 AM »
^ Key phrases:  will likely, eventually, intended to, could be

Offline jmicha

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5727 on: September 20, 2018, 11:53:24 AM »
I find it hilarious that so many here talk about these projects as though they are some type of super race whose opinions are more important than those of the persons who actually own the land and pay for the development and live with the results. Kind of a nerd elitism.

Huge surface lots in the urban core are well-documented negative assets. They starve streets of life, increase rainwater runoff, and as reduce property taxes collected as mentioned above. We have every right to criticize their creation.

Offline DEPACincy

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5728 on: September 20, 2018, 12:08:26 PM »
I find it hilarious that so many here talk about these projects as though they are some type of super race whose opinions are more important than those of the persons who actually own the land and pay for the development and live with the results. Kind of a nerd elitism.

Huge surface lots in the urban core are well-documented negative assets. They starve streets of life, increase rainwater runoff, and as reduce property taxes collected as mentioned above. We have every right to criticize their creation.

We need to move to a stormwater charge like they have in Philly and throughout Maryland:

http://www.phillywatersheds.org/non-residential-stormwater-information

Offline carnevalem

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Re: Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)
« Reply #5729 on: September 20, 2018, 12:22:18 PM »
I find it hilarious that so many here talk about these projects as though they are some type of super race whose opinions are more important than those of the persons who actually own the land and pay for the development and live with the results. Kind of a nerd elitism.

Huge surface lots in the urban core are well-documented negative assets. They starve streets of life, increase rainwater runoff, and as reduce property taxes collected as mentioned above. We have every right to criticize their creation.

We need to move to a stormwater charge like they have in Philly and throughout Maryland:

http://www.phillywatersheds.org/non-residential-stormwater-information

And a land value tax instead of a property tax.