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Ohio Discussion => City Discussion => Topic started by: KJP on December 07, 2017, 10:04:23 AM

Title: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: KJP on December 07, 2017, 10:04:23 AM
FBI, IRS, HUD conduct nighttime raid at Cleveland City Hall
http://www.cleveland.com/court-justice/index.ssf/2017/12/irs_fbi_and_hud_conduct_nightt.html
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: Oldmanladyluck on December 07, 2017, 10:23:34 AM
This can't be good...
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 07, 2017, 10:32:36 AM
If I were a betting a man, I might assume this could have something to do with this;

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2017/11/fomer_collinwood_development_c.html
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: E Rocc on December 07, 2017, 10:35:20 AM
If I were a betting a man, I might assume this could have something to do with this;

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2017/11/fomer_collinwood_development_c.html

Sounds about right, but why HUD?  Section 8 fraud as well?
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 07, 2017, 10:36:13 AM
^ The CDCs are funded in part by CDBG funds which come from HUD.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: wpcc88 on December 07, 2017, 11:00:34 AM
Hopefully this somehow leads to the end of Jackson!
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 07, 2017, 11:04:09 AM
Hopefully this somehow leads to the end of Jackson!

I doubt it.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: gottaplan on December 07, 2017, 11:10:43 AM
I doubt it also.  Feds move slowly.  If they wanted him gone, could've made the raid before the election....
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 07, 2017, 11:12:32 AM
We also don't know the extent of what the feds are looking for. This may not reach the mayors office.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: YABO713 on December 07, 2017, 12:23:55 PM
From what I'm hearing the HUD agents were the lead agents, which tells me it won't reach the mayor.

If it reaches the Mayor, we can kiss whatever shot we had at Amazon good bye.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: 327 on December 07, 2017, 03:19:07 PM
From the article, this lady had three prior convictions for employee theft but we had her running a CDC.  I hope this does reach the mayor.  It seems there's no other way to get rid of him.  Seems like only yesterday the federal government had to step in and protect our bus system from him.  Thanks feds!  Nice to see you again.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: X on December 07, 2017, 03:23:46 PM
CDC directors aren't hired by the mayor.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 07, 2017, 03:26:21 PM
She also wasn't the executive director of the CDC.  CDCs throw around the title director like banks throw around VP.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: 327 on December 07, 2017, 03:39:06 PM
CDC directors aren't hired by the mayor.

He has considerable budgetary authority, and we don't yet know the extent of what they're looking at.

She also wasn't the executive director of the CDC.  CDCs throw around the title director like banks throw around VP.

That's part of the problem.  Regardless of title, she had enough authority to acquire a Harley with federal development funds.  Every aspect of how we spend that money should be under review.  By whom, I don't even know.  That's another part of the problem.  The feds took down our County government a few years back, and now the new one's corrupt.  Budish is fighting tooth and nail for unchecked authority to shovel money toward his friends.  Presently he claims to already have that authority on no other grounds than tradition!  And rather than ending the practice, he wants to codify it.  At least the Council is moderately skeptical.

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2017/12/cuyahoga_county_asks_county_council_to_allow_officials_to_pay_salaried_employees_beyond_40_hours.html#incart_river_home
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: bumsquare on December 07, 2017, 03:43:49 PM
She also wasn't the executive director of the CDC.  CDCs throw around the title director like banks throw around VP.
Article says she was executive director. It's been a while since I worked at a Cleveland CDC but the annual block grant amount available to individual councilpeople (the main source of funding for most CDCs) is under 500k. So embezzling @200k is pretty brazen.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 07, 2017, 03:47:31 PM
^ my bad.  I thought the article said she was the ED director. Anyway, this is bad and she needs to be brought to justice.  I'm just not sure how much the Mayor should have known or not known.  I am not a huge Mayor Jackson btw.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: Gramarye on December 07, 2017, 04:15:55 PM
I know next to nothing about Mayor Jackson, but just structurally, I'm still having trouble with how a fraud investigation into the CEO/ED of a CDC would warrant a nighttime raid on City Hall.  I get that CDBG funds can pass through political authorities to CDCs under HUD rules.  That alone doesn't seem to make the kind of connection that this would require.

I saw in the Scene that the FBI said this involves a sealed federal court proceeding, so we can't know for certain yet, but still.

https://www.clevescene.com/scene-and-heard/archives/2017/12/07/fbi-irs-hud-raided-cleveland-city-hall-last-night
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: KJP on December 07, 2017, 10:23:05 PM
From Fox8
Sources inside Cleveland City Hall tell me they're hearing Department of Community Development and Mayor's Office of Capital Projects were subject of raid by federal authorities last night. Many on council say they're in the dark on this.
https://twitter.com/mattwrighttv/status/938811154935279617
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: KJP on December 07, 2017, 10:59:19 PM
He sounds guilty or stupid...

Mayor Frank Jackson, asked on @soundofideas about the visit by federal agents at Cleveland city hall last night: "I won't be able to comment about it. You just gave me more information than I know, that HUD was involved in it and IRS."
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: jeremyck01 on December 08, 2017, 03:07:27 AM
He sounds guilty or stupid...

Mayor Frank Jackson, asked on @soundofideas about the visit by federal agents at Cleveland city hall last night: "I won't be able to comment about it. You just gave me more information than I know, that HUD was involved in it and IRS."

Guilty of being stupid.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: 327 on December 08, 2017, 11:30:13 AM
http://www.cleveland.com/court-justice/index.ssf/2017/12/what_is_burton_scot_the_compan.html#incart_2box

Sounds like there's a lot going on here, maybe involving kickbacks?
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: gottaplan on December 08, 2017, 12:59:15 PM
He sounds guilty or stupid...

Mayor Frank Jackson, asked on @soundofideas about the visit by federal agents at Cleveland city hall last night: "I won't be able to comment about it. You just gave me more information than I know, that HUD was involved in it and IRS."

Guilty of being stupid.

I'd say just the opposite.  I think Frank is clean and honest and probably not worried about the investigation at all from a personal standpoint
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: Pugu on December 08, 2017, 01:35:21 PM
^I think Frank is probably clean as well. But I agree that he comes off sounding a little stupid. If it were my city hall, I'd want to know which federal agencies were in it and at which departments.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 08, 2017, 01:36:42 PM
^ In his defense the news broke when he was in his interview.  He was most likely surprised by it which is why he wouldn't comment on it.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: Pugu on December 08, 2017, 01:49:11 PM
^But he should know things before it comes from the news. CPD guards all the entrances to City Hall and thus knows what's entering the building, especially after hours. And CPD works for Jackson.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: freefourur on December 08, 2017, 01:54:21 PM
It's possible he knew the FBI was there because that might be who had the warrant and the fact that HUD and IRS were there was a shock. 
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: Gramarye on December 08, 2017, 04:06:49 PM
I don't know Frank Jackson from Adam and couldn't even pick him out of a picture unless the caption pointed out who he is.  But people tend to have excessively superhuman assumptions about public officials or private executives--anyone who has departments working for them.  In the short term, the fact that you have 5 or 50 or 500 or 500,000 people "working for you" means precisely jack about what you're likely to know when put on the spot about a breaking news development, or even about what your own department(s) is doing at any exact moment in time five or ten levels down the chain.

I've got people working for me.  At this very moment, there are probably between 100 and 200 matters moving across their desks.  I have basic familiarity with maybe forty of those, working knowledge of maybe ten, and detailed knowledge of at most five.  Some of those that I have general working knowledge about might be ones that I had detailed knowledge about last month, but I've long since forgotten in the rush of other matters that have risen to the top of the priority list, and no one can hold everything in brain-RAM forever.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: KJP on December 08, 2017, 10:34:32 PM
I hate it when Gram makes sense...
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: KJP on December 08, 2017, 11:12:40 PM
Most detailed description of this investigation I've seen yet...

Records show evidence seized by agents during Cleveland City Hall raid
POSTED 7:36 PM, DECEMBER 8, 2017, BY MATT WRIGHT

CLEVELAND- Federal agents seized ten items, including documents involving a company owned by a city employee, during a search at Cleveland City Hall Wednesday, according to a federal search warrant and evidence recovery log.

According to the warrant, FBI, IRS and U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development agents searched the fifth floor Division of Engineering and Construction office from 9 p.m. to 12:40 a.m.

The log shows agents seized plans for two projects by Pioneer Engineering, a company owned by Khalil Ewais, who is listed on the city website as an engineer and construction inspector in the Mayor's Office of Capital Projects.

The log shows one of the plans involved a business on Lorain Avenue at West 128th Street, and the other involved a property on Carnegie Avenue.

MORE:
http://fox8.com/2017/12/08/records-show-evidence-seized-by-agents-during-cleveland-city-hall-raid/
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: surfohio on December 09, 2017, 12:35:36 AM
I don't know Frank Jackson from Adam and couldn't even pick him out of a picture unless the caption pointed out who he is. 

He looks a lot like George Bush era Phil Jackson.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: GCrites80s on December 09, 2017, 12:45:31 AM
I don't know Frank Jackson from Adam and couldn't even pick him out of a picture unless the caption pointed out who he is.  But people tend to have excessively superhuman assumptions about public officials or private executives--anyone who has departments working for them.  In the short term, the fact that you have 5 or 50 or 500 or 500,000 people "working for you" means precisely jack about what you're likely to know when put on the spot about a breaking news development, or even about what your own department(s) is doing at any exact moment in time five or ten levels down the chain.

I've got people working for me.  At this very moment, there are probably between 100 and 200 matters moving across their desks.  I have basic familiarity with maybe forty of those, working knowledge of maybe ten, and detailed knowledge of at most five.  Some of those that I have general working knowledge about might be ones that I had detailed knowledge about last month, but I've long since forgotten in the rush of other matters that have risen to the top of the priority list, and no one can hold everything in brain-RAM forever.

Yeah, it's like I have to go to jail when one of my employees prices a foil Magic The Gathering card like it's a non-foil on a day that I'm at my other store.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: 327 on December 09, 2017, 11:49:16 AM
It's not fair to expect anyone to cough up answers on the spot.  Especially in a criminal investigation, 5th amendment applies.  But it's also not fair for a mayor (of unprecedented power) to claim no responsibility for what happens on his watch.  He'll get plenty of time to answer.  And he'll have to answer for the people he installed and the people they installed.  If you don't want that kind of responsibility, you don't run for mayor.
Title: Re: Cleveland: FBI, IRS, HUD make nighttime raid on City Hall
Post by: KJP on December 11, 2017, 04:57:48 PM
Yup, if you don't know what's going on in your own house, you can make it sound like you've confidential insights by saying "I have no public comment to make regarding this inquiry at this time."