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Author Topic: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News  (Read 12115 times)

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Offline surfohio

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2550 on: September 19, 2017, 08:01:46 PM »
Props to Green Ribbon (including some all star UO folks) for proposing an interesting alternative.

I think the bridge is visually interesting but very much lacking in practicality. The bridge just doesn't seem to integrate well with the much needed NC Transit Center. By the way, glad to hear the purported support from Jackson, great news.

I'll go ahead and dust off the Lakefront Convention Center proposal, because once I saw it that made it hard for me to settle for anything else.   

Offline Davidsmith121

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2551 on: September 19, 2017, 10:20:31 PM »

It is worth revisiting the proposed designs from the 2009 lakefront station Cleveland Design Competition. The 2nd place design is very similar to the latest design proposal from Green Ribbon.


Offline tastybunns

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2552 on: September 19, 2017, 11:16:09 PM »
I'd rather make the area as visually appealing as possible. Instead of a winding suspension bridge that spans over the rails and roadway, why not bridge over it with as much land cover as possible... wouldn't it make sense to enhance the environment, covering over mass transportation eye-sores? One thing I like about the Nexus plan; which I know it's part of a design competition, is that it covers and hides the peripheral vision of both the highway and the rails; all while updating the station which desperately needs aesthetic attention. I know the station is basically federal because it's Amtrak, but isn't it also connected via blue/green rta lines? So do we even need federal approval to rebuild the station?

Currently I'm all in favor of bridging land over roadways and railways. Is there any way we could build over these transits to where they become like another tower city?

Also I love tunnels. I recently went over to Paris, France and they have a sub-city highway that runs through the financial district of the city. It even encompasses a metro line. It's the A14 which turns into N13 and it goes straight to the Arc De Triomphe. Paris did something right hiding their motorways. Good for expansion when cities run out of room. This being said, can we just completely bridge over i-90 turning it into another green ribbon? I'd also be in favor or ridding i-90 of the super frequent exits through the campus district. Its something we don't need right before smashing into Dead-Mans curve. I think this would help lakefront access. A good lakefront is one thing, accessibility and walkability are another thing.

*sorry if I spewed off topic*
« Last Edit: September 19, 2017, 11:17:23 PM by tastybunns »

Online KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2553 on: September 20, 2017, 08:10:18 AM »
I'd rather make the area as visually appealing as possible. Instead of a winding suspension bridge that spans over the rails and roadway, why not bridge over it with as much land cover as possible... wouldn't it make sense to enhance the environment, covering over mass transportation eye-sores? One thing I like about the Nexus plan; which I know it's part of a design competition, is that it covers and hides the peripheral vision of both the highway and the rails; all while updating the station which desperately needs aesthetic attention. I know the station is basically federal because it's Amtrak, but isn't it also connected via blue/green rta lines? So do we even need federal approval to rebuild the station?

This project won't happen without federal funds. And Amtrak isn't an influencing factor here. It owns no property in the project area. It does have an easement, as does GCRTA. But unlike GCRTA, Amtrak has never paid a dime of rent or other compensation for its easement. The Amtrak station sits here because the city wanted them here rather than at Cleveland Union Terminal when Amtrak's Lake Shore service returned in 1975 after a three-year hiatus. No compensation was ever demanded by the city in 1975 so Amtrak never paid anything. However, to hedge against the city changing its mind, Amtrak purchased a strip of land in the fading East 26th Rail Yard that was used for storing and staging iron ore jennies, which is where Amtrak could relocate its Cleveland station just in case. That site no longer works for Amtrak as it is east of where Amtrak's two routes split; any Amtrak station has to be at or west of the walkway between the North Point office building and its parking garage. BTW, the portion of the yard closest to South Marginal Road is being considered as the new location for the Cleveland outlet mall.

And yes, considering this is a significant transportation project that is likely to use federal funds, the project development process will have to follow the National Environmental Policy Act. That means that any final site selected as well as preliminary and final designs will have to be approved by all federal agencies having jurisdiction including the Federal Highway Administration, Federal Railroad Administration, Federal Transit Administration and possibly others as well.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. -- Abraham Lincoln.

Online X

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2554 on: October 28, 2017, 04:12:47 PM »

A Highway Runs Through It
The demolition of the FirstEnergy plant presents Cleveland a unique opportunity to return neglected Gordon Park to its glory days, but a few obstacles stand in the way
By Daniel McGraw


Let's do a hypothetical. You're in University Circle with some friends from out of town. Maybe you're enjoying a bite in Little Italy or gazing in awe at the world-class collection at the Cleveland Museum of Art. It's been fun. Your friends are thrilled. What about Lake Erie, though? It's close, isn't it? They've never seen a Great Lake before and want to bask in the freshwater wonder before leaving town. Any lakefront parks close by that you can take them to?

You think for a minute and rattle of the options: Mentor Headlands 30 miles to the east; Huntington Beach 20 miles to the west; East Ninth by the Rock Hall, a pier not a park; and Edgewater Park about 10 miles away just west of downtown. Maybe you check Google to make sure you haven't missed anything else that's it, right? or maybe some trace of a memory emerges and you say, oh yeah, there's one more option: the Gordon Park area -- with its fishing piers and boat launch ramps -- just three miles north, a nice ride down MLK Jr. Dr. through Rockefeller Park. Seems like the obvious choice, right?

https://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/a-highway-runs-through-it/Content?oid=11243699&utm_source=Cleveland+Scene+-+Weekly+Newsletters&utm_campaign=9e3eb9c970-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_10_18&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_63c629abc4-9e3eb9c970-35256177

Online E Rocc

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2555 on: October 30, 2017, 11:22:31 PM »

A Highway Runs Through It
The demolition of the FirstEnergy plant presents Cleveland a unique opportunity to return neglected Gordon Park to its glory days, but a few obstacles stand in the way
By Daniel McGraw


Let's do a hypothetical. You're in University Circle with some friends from out of town. Maybe you're enjoying a bite in Little Italy or gazing in awe at the world-class collection at the Cleveland Museum of Art. It's been fun. Your friends are thrilled. What about Lake Erie, though? It's close, isn't it? They've never seen a Great Lake before and want to bask in the freshwater wonder before leaving town. Any lakefront parks close by that you can take them to?

You think for a minute and rattle of the options: Mentor Headlands 30 miles to the east; Huntington Beach 20 miles to the west; East Ninth by the Rock Hall, a pier not a park; and Edgewater Park about 10 miles away just west of downtown. Maybe you check Google to make sure you haven't missed anything else that's it, right? or maybe some trace of a memory emerges and you say, oh yeah, there's one more option: the Gordon Park area -- with its fishing piers and boat launch ramps -- just three miles north, a nice ride down MLK Jr. Dr. through Rockefeller Park. Seems like the obvious choice, right?

https://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/a-highway-runs-through-it/Content?oid=11243699&utm_source=Cleveland+Scene+-+Weekly+Newsletters&utm_campaign=9e3eb9c970-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_10_18&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_63c629abc4-9e3eb9c970-35256177

Villa Angela/Euclid Beach isn't bad at all either, and I understand they are doing some upgrades.

Offline MidwestChamp

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2556 on: October 31, 2017, 06:03:02 PM »

A Highway Runs Through It
The demolition of the FirstEnergy plant presents Cleveland a unique opportunity to return neglected Gordon Park to its glory days, but a few obstacles stand in the way
By Daniel McGraw


Let's do a hypothetical. You're in University Circle with some friends from out of town. Maybe you're enjoying a bite in Little Italy or gazing in awe at the world-class collection at the Cleveland Museum of Art. It's been fun. Your friends are thrilled. What about Lake Erie, though? It's close, isn't it? They've never seen a Great Lake before and want to bask in the freshwater wonder before leaving town. Any lakefront parks close by that you can take them to?

You think for a minute and rattle of the options: Mentor Headlands 30 miles to the east; Huntington Beach 20 miles to the west; East Ninth by the Rock Hall, a pier not a park; and Edgewater Park about 10 miles away just west of downtown. Maybe you check Google to make sure you haven't missed anything else that's it, right? or maybe some trace of a memory emerges and you say, oh yeah, there's one more option: the Gordon Park area -- with its fishing piers and boat launch ramps -- just three miles north, a nice ride down MLK Jr. Dr. through Rockefeller Park. Seems like the obvious choice, right?

https://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/a-highway-runs-through-it/Content?oid=11243699&utm_source=Cleveland+Scene+-+Weekly+Newsletters&utm_campaign=9e3eb9c970-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_10_18&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_63c629abc4-9e3eb9c970-35256177

I really think moving the shroeway in the manner depicted here makes sense.  Gordon Park was once the beautiful lakefront head to Rockefeller Park but was destroyed by the freeway.   But this is a once in 100 year opportunity to correct that mistake, if we begin planning for it now before other interest start making decisions that cannot be undone.

Online KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2557 on: November 06, 2017, 05:59:09 PM »
Rumors are that the city is at least continuing (if not intensifying) its efforts to move the SS Cod for Geis' development and the Mather for the Pace development.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. -- Abraham Lincoln.

Offline lockdog

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2558 on: November 06, 2017, 07:24:51 PM »
I would love to see development continue on the lakefront...  my idea would be to build a boardwalk north of Burke and put them there...??

Offline dave2017

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2559 on: November 06, 2017, 09:04:05 PM »
Rumors are that the city is at least continuing (if not intensifying) its efforts to move the SS Cod for Geis' development and the Mather for the Pace development.


Isn't The Mather part of The GLSC? 


Online E Rocc

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2560 on: November 07, 2017, 12:01:13 AM »
Rumors are that the city is at least continuing (if not intensifying) its efforts to move the SS Cod for Geis' development and the Mather for the Pace development.

The USS Cod is a National Historical Landmark, so moving her might be problematic especially for private development.

Though supposedly she is actually still seaworthy so an effort to put her in the water and take her out on special occasions might gain traction.   Though she would have to be protected from ice.

Offline YABO713

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2561 on: November 07, 2017, 08:31:22 AM »
Rumors are that the city is at least continuing (if not intensifying) its efforts to move the SS Cod for Geis' development and the Mather for the Pace development.

It is.


Isn't The Mather part of The GLSC? 



Online KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2562 on: November 07, 2017, 09:15:44 AM »
Here's the background:
http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2015/12/uss_cod_gains_traction_as_clev.html

Historic or landmark status doesn't prevent the city from moving the Cod. It does create additional layers of approvals/hearings necessary before a move can occur, however.

I'm sure the city would find and fund for the Cod and Mather new locations before moving them.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. -- Abraham Lincoln.

Offline Pugu

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2563 on: November 07, 2017, 11:07:55 AM »
from the PD article: "A local landmark designation would apply to both the submarine and the half-acre piece of public property where it has been moored for more than 50 years"

this is crazy. Is should apply to the sub only. There's nothing historical to the land around it. All it does is make lakefront development more difficult. The sub is a water vessel -- it can be moved. Lakefront land cannot.

Online freethink

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Re: Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News
« Reply #2564 on: November 07, 2017, 11:19:58 PM »
So a couple of years ago I floated the idea ( see what I did there) about moving the USS COD over to the old Coast Guard Station (page 40 of this thread). With the possible move of the COD in the future just wanted to bring that up again. The Coast Guard station is undergoing renovations now with more to come. I am saying it could be a component of something bigger there as an added attraction to whatever use the station finds. Below is a mock-up that another forumer put together at the time.