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Author Topic: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ  (Read 999 times)

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Online jmicha

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #30 on: June 20, 2017, 07:37:15 AM »
So cryptic. Sounds like good news though! Hopefully...

Any more details on when/what we can expect to be announced?

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #31 on: June 20, 2017, 08:21:53 AM »
.... ^ what does this mean?

If the board decides something good today regarding their facilities, you may want to hug them. Lots of different directions they could go, however.
"Give me control of a nation's money supply, and I care not who writes the laws." -- Mayer Amschel Rothschild, founder of the European banking dynasty.

Online jmicha

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #32 on: June 20, 2017, 08:26:24 AM »
Damn, and here I was thinking a good decision was already made.

Well hopefully the outcome of today is something we can all get behind and will have an impact on Downtown.

Offline simplythis

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #33 on: June 20, 2017, 04:48:01 PM »
So does anyone know what is the outcome
of today's board member meeting?

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #34 on: June 21, 2017, 08:47:16 AM »
So by all accounts, the "big decision" wasn't made yesterday as negotiations are still underway. Apparently MM likes a site or sites but doesn't like the numbers and wants to make it work. However, the board reportedly made some smaller, related decisions regarding the relocation of some business functions out of MM-owned buildings. I'm not sure which ones those are as  I don't know what to make of that last part. They involve a small number of employees, so moving them again in a few years wouldn't be a big deal. It **could** be a good sign. But it's still frustrating that the big move apparently wasn't decided yet.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2017, 09:03:17 AM by KJP »
"Give me control of a nation's money supply, and I care not who writes the laws." -- Mayer Amschel Rothschild, founder of the European banking dynasty.

Offline sky

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #35 on: June 21, 2017, 09:07:17 AM »
Thanks KJP.  When is the next board meeting?  Is there a online list of board members?

Online mrclifton88

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #36 on: June 21, 2017, 09:09:59 AM »
Do we know if there is a desire among the decision makers to stay downtown?  I know it was brought up before that they may be considering suburban sites... but I am curious whether that was just a strategic play or an actual serious potential destination.

Online wpcc88

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #37 on: June 21, 2017, 09:23:14 AM »
Do we know if there is a desire among the decision makers to stay downtown?  I know it was brought up before that they may be considering suburban sites... but I am curious whether that was just a strategic play or an actual serious potential destination.

From what I've gathered they want to remain at the Rose building.  However it's just not a reality because the end goal is to bring those from Strongsville and Beachwood back downtown.  There are certainly buildings downtown big enough to house them all but not sure if any have the occupancy available.

Offline FrqntFlyr

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Offline ethlaw

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #39 on: June 21, 2017, 10:02:42 AM »
Do we know if there is a desire among the decision makers to stay downtown?  I know it was brought up before that they may be considering suburban sites... but I am curious whether that was just a strategic play or an actual serious potential destination.

From what I've gathered they want to remain at the Rose building.  However it's just not a reality because the end goal is to bring those from Strongsville and Beachwood back downtown.  There are certainly buildings downtown big enough to house them all but not sure if any have the occupancy available.

So, are they not even considering a new building?

Offline originaljbw

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #40 on: June 21, 2017, 11:06:25 AM »
What if there plan is to keep the rose building, but also anchor a new tower on the hippodrome lots? Even though the building that housed 811 is in the way (makes you wonder why it so suddenly closed), it's feet away across the E 8th street alley.
Someone mentioned camera drones checking out the backside of the building... maybe it's to see how potential connections to the existing building would work. 

Offline simplythis

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #41 on: June 21, 2017, 11:37:27 AM »
iS 811 ON Euclid or Prospect

Offline originaljbw

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #42 on: June 21, 2017, 11:45:32 AM »
It was on prospect.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #43 on: June 21, 2017, 12:01:49 PM »
So, are they not even considering a new building?

They may be considering a new building but they wouldn't own it. Medical Mutual has said that they do not want to own whatever building they end up in even if it's new. So the negotiations may be over the long-term lease of that building.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2017, 12:02:22 PM by KJP »
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Offline heightsfan

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #44 on: June 21, 2017, 12:01:54 PM »
Can we kindly limit the rampant speculation.  Some of us check these boards for actual information/intel.   Also, 811 is getting a makeover and going to reopen as something else in the fall.  There's an article in Cleveland Scene about it.  The current concept/menu wasn't working apparently. 
« Last Edit: June 21, 2017, 12:04:13 PM by heightsfan »

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #45 on: June 21, 2017, 12:03:49 PM »
Thanks KJP.  When is the next board meeting?  Is there a online list of board members?

One month from now, I believe. A special board meeting could always be held for a very important matter such as this.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2017, 12:04:16 PM by KJP »
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Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #46 on: July 07, 2017, 04:17:31 PM »
Some movement... The following company was recently assigned to be the receiver of the Medical Mutual HQ building and to service the debt on commercial mortgage-backed securities (CMBS)....
http://www.resolutionsemr.com/assignments/medical-mutual-headquarters/

EDIT: I'm reminded of this portion of a PD article from last year.....

An affiliate of BentleyForbes, a Los Angeles-based landlord, recently said it would be unable to repay or refinance a loan on the Medical Mutual complex, comprised of the 10-story Rose Building and its six-story annex at East Ninth Street and Prospect Avenue. Control of the loan, which matured Jan. 1, transferred in December to a special servicer, a company that deals with troubled commercial real estate debt. If the lender and borrower can't work out a deal, the Medical Mutual complex, at 2060 E. Ninth St., could be the subject of foreclosure litigation or a receivership.

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2016/01/medical_mutual_hq_mortgage_in.html

So it seems now that this happened -- the MM HQ is the subject of a receivership and RE Solutions is the receiver. If you go to their home page (http://www.resolutionsemr.com/), you'll see that the MM HQ is the only property listed under "latest assignments."

BTW, the same company that owns the MM HQ (BentleyForbes) also owns MM's 500-employee Toledo office and MM's small data center in Beachwood. FWIW.

BTW2, MM has said any actions involving the ownership of its current HQ (or presumably its Toledo and Beachwood offices) don't affect the company's leases, all of which expire in 2020. While that may be true, it has to affect MM's site search.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 06:00:47 PM by KJP »
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Offline simplythis

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #47 on: July 07, 2017, 07:34:07 PM »
So is this good news, Bad news or No news. Anybody have an idea.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #48 on: July 07, 2017, 08:08:28 PM »
Here's my take -- Everything I've heard about MM's possible course of action is that it will not stay in any of its existing buildings across Northeast Ohio and that there will be **some** consolidation. That may mean one building (presumably a new building due to the lack of open space in existing buildings), but more likely it means two buildings (one downtown, one in the suburbs) from what little I've heard. The issue is what is causing the delay in MM's board making a decision? It appears that MM is trying to get a better deal from a developer/property owner. Another angle not exclusive of the one in the prior sentence (and one that I'd not thought of until seeing the news about MM's HQ receiver) is that the delay may also have had to do with uncertainty about the owner of its existing building(s) and trying to get a lease extension from the new receiver so it can strengthen its negotiating stance.
 
That may also extend to the situation involving MM's Toledo building. It has to be a part of this too. Lucas County records show that their building at 3737 West Sylvania Avenue is still owned by BentleyForbes. The owner is shown as:

Owner - MMTO LLC A DELAWARE LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY
Property Address - 3737 W SYLVANIA AVE, TOLEDO OH 43623
Mailing Address   - 10877 WILSHIRE BLVD STE 1100, LOS ANGELES CA 90024

But the mailing address in LA lists to Fred Wehba. He's the founder of BentleyForbes.

If this office is part of the receivership too, it **could** mean that MM's Toledo employees will also be moved. Will they stay in Toledo but in a different building? Or might be they be moved to Cleveland? Are there any efficiencies to be gained by consolidating them into a Cleveland HQ (and/or suburban office). I think the latest news about the receiver means the Toledo office situation was just as fluid as the Cleveland office situation, and they could both be stabilized by the naming of the receiver and by a new Cleveland building site(s).
« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 08:11:10 PM by KJP »
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Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #49 on: July 19, 2017, 03:32:51 PM »
If MM's board met this month, it would have yesterday. But everything appears quiet. I don't know if they didn't meet or just didn't act on a facility consolidation/relocation plan. None of the usual suspects have heard anything.
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Online Clefan98

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #50 on: July 30, 2017, 08:32:27 AM »
Medical Mutual soon might reacquire its headquarters

Circumstances at its longtime headquarters in the 10-story Rose Building in downtown Cleveland may make it attractive for Medical Mutual of Ohio to stay in place.

The health insurer, which has 1,000 workers stationed at the building at 2060 E. Ninth St., for almost a year has conducted a search for a new headquarters, or perhaps staying in place, that also considers combining its suburban and downtown workforces at another location.

The buy-and-stay possibility has surfaced in a brief in a Cuyahoga County foreclosure case between its landlord, an affiliate of Los Angeles-based Bentley Forbes Group referred to as MMCO LLC, and the holder of the mortgage on the property.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20170730/NEWS/170739989/medical-mutual-soon-might-reacquire-its-headquarters

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2017, 10:37:29 AM »
This would buy them time to make a better deal for a new HQ location. I don't see them staying put in an obsolete office building.
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Online YABO713

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #52 on: July 30, 2017, 11:52:17 AM »
This would buy them time to make a better deal for a new HQ location. I don't see them staying put in an obsolete office building.

I seldom do this, @KJP but I disagree with you.

I think a move to purchase is a sign that they're committed to revamping the building. It's becoming more and more unusual for companies to actually own their HQ, and acquiring the property, in my opinion, shows a doubling down of sorts on the Rose Building.

Online Dougal

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #53 on: July 30, 2017, 12:12:25 PM »
I seldom do this, @KJP but I disagree with you.

I think a move to purchase is a sign that they're committed to revamping the building. It's becoming more and more unusual for companies to actually own their HQ, and acquiring the property, in my opinion, shows a doubling down of sorts on the Rose Building.

They may want minimal perturbation while medical insurance issues get sorted out in DC. Staying put is probably the least-cost option. That doesn't say it wouldn't be worth their while to bring the suburban offices downtown. There's ample space nearby that could be buffed up by 2020.
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Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #54 on: July 30, 2017, 01:27:35 PM »
I seldom do this, @KJP but I disagree with you.

I think a move to purchase is a sign that they're committed to revamping the building. It's becoming more and more unusual for companies to actually own their HQ, and acquiring the property, in my opinion, shows a doubling down of sorts on the Rose Building.

Everything that I've been hearing is that MM is facing lots of uncertainties. It is either in negotiations with a developer/landlord, waiting for the mess in Washington DC to sort itself out, or both. Articles from last year also provide clear evidence that MM doesn't like it's existing HQ building which lacks open-floor layouts and is very costly to heat and cool. Add to that the uncertainty regarding the serious, nationwide financial troubles faced by its building owner, BentleyForbes (which also owns its 500-employee Toledo office). MM has been reluctant to make a big any big real estate moves until these issues have sorted themselves out.

Let's look at which of the uncertainties MM can control.... MM can only control half of the negotiations with a new building developer/landlord, it has virtually zero control over the mess in Washington DC, but it can take complete control of the ownership/financial troubles faced by the owner of its current HQ. By doing that, MM gains time, bargaining power and thus greater control over negotiations with a new building developer/landlord and it buys MM time to wait out the mess in Washington DC. It could be a long-term commitment but I doubt it. The acquisition goes against MM's policy of owning its buildings. They did it because it gives them more control. I don't see them owning it or staying there for long.

The only other thing I can see happening here is that someone like K&D steps in and agrees to buy the Rose Building and signs an open-ended lease with MM. MM could stay there as long as it likes, until such time it decides to leave. That way K&D can amortize at least part of the purchase price over the next 3-5 years with revenues from a stable office user occupying 100 percent of the building. That would reduce the overall costs of a residential conversion later on by not having as much of the residential rents amortizing the acquisition debt.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2017, 01:31:46 PM by KJP »
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Offline cle25

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #55 on: August 02, 2017, 11:33:05 AM »
My wife works at MM. From what she has heard, if they were to buy their building it would be a long-term commitment to staying put. Apparently they are trying to work out a deal with BF by the end of September. This transaction is further complicated by the financial troubles of the seller that others have alluded to.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #56 on: August 02, 2017, 11:44:56 AM »
Well that would suck.
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Online YABO713

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #57 on: August 02, 2017, 11:57:55 AM »
My wife works at MM. From what she has heard, if they were to buy their building it would be a long-term commitment to staying put. Apparently they are trying to work out a deal with BF by the end of September. This transaction is further complicated by the financial troubles of the seller that others have alluded to.

Stupid question - what is BF

Offline Pleco

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #58 on: August 02, 2017, 12:02:02 PM »
My wife works at MM. From what she has heard, if they were to buy their building it would be a long-term commitment to staying put. Apparently they are trying to work out a deal with BF by the end of September. This transaction is further complicated by the financial troubles of the seller that others have alluded to.

Stupid question - what is BF

Bentley Forbes Group

Offline KJP

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Re: Cleveland: Downtown: Medical Mutual HQ
« Reply #59 on: August 04, 2017, 10:27:48 AM »
The word is that MM may have difficulty acquiring the Rose Building in a timely manner due to the involvement of a receiver in Bentley Forbes' ultimate dissolution. From what I understand is that MM will make its decision on whether to fish or cut bait on the Rose Building in September. However there is information that MM is looking at a number of alternatives including existing buildings downtown and in the suburbs. One of the sites mentioned was American Greetings' vacated headquarters in Brooklyn. And yes, consolidation of MM's Northeast Ohio offices is still on the table.

BTW, the American Greetings offices are too small to accommodate MM's HQ but could accommodate the consolidated suburban offices, if MM keeps its HQ at Rose or has to move the 380,000 sf to another downtown site.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2017, 10:59:11 AM by KJP »
"Give me control of a nation's money supply, and I care not who writes the laws." -- Mayer Amschel Rothschild, founder of the European banking dynasty.