Topic: Cincinnati: Clifton Heights: U Square @ the Loop

[jmecklenborg]

I guess they tore all that down by 2005-06 so basically no current UC students remember what used to be there. 

[jmicha]

I believe that is true. My first visit to UC was Spring of 2006 and by that time (if I'm remembering correctly) UPA was already under construction and I only walked through the area once before actually coming to UC for the 2007-2008 year. I've seen a picture or two floating around in the past, but never any large shots of what used to be there.

[LincolnKennedy]

My recollection of these plans are that the development is not nearly dense and tall enough, particularly when the Streetcar is supposed to connect to it.  Unless you are trying to keep a certain historic feel to an area (like OTR, but it would be easy to keep the historic feel while at the same time greatly increasing density) on the Streetcar route the City really needs to encourage taller buildings in the vicinity.

[pointycollars]

Here's some pics of the rowhouses that used to sit between Calhoun and McMillan. The ones on the Calhoun side were vacant, so I was able to get inside. The ones on McMillan were occupied right up until they were demolished. I believe these pics are from spring of 2003. In the second pic you can see they haven't even begun construction of UPA yet, so you can see Shoemaker in the background

[OCtoCincy]

DAMN-

Those were really nice.  This is ridiculous. Cincinnati needs to get its preservation act together.  That last picture looks like it could be from London or Liverpool.  Very disappointing. 

[jmicha]

That's a shame really...although I don't mind what they're doing to the site (mostly because I've only known it as an empty field) those look like they could have been spectacular if someone put some care into them. I know I sure as heck would have liked to have been given the opportunity.

[City Blights]

DAMN-

Those were really nice.  This is ridiculous. Cincinnati needs to get its preservation act together.  That last picture looks like it could be from London or Liverpool.  Very disappointing. 

It's supposed to be difficult to demo a building in the city of Cincinnati b/c of preservation and historical designations in certain areas.  I'm not sure if money is exchanging hands back-door or not, but from what I've seen the last ten years, MANY of the demos appeared to have value and weren't by any means the principal eyesore of the block.  Yet many of those crumbling walkups stand and the less challenging reclamation projects are lost to memory.

I'll be glad when Cincinnati is starting to hit its stride in 2017 or so, causing these demos to come to a dry trickle citywide.  Then again, it's a probability that the Westside and Avondale will still be going through this.

[pointycollars]

From what I've heard, the University has owned that property between McMillan and Calhoun for something like 30 years and were just sitting on it.

[dvdbengals]

DAMN-

Those were really nice.  This is ridiculous. Cincinnati needs to get its preservation act together.  That last picture looks like it could be from London or Liverpool.  Very disappointing. 

It's supposed to be difficult to demo a building in the city of Cincinnati b/c of preservation and historical designations in certain areas.  I'm not sure if money is exchanging hands back-door or not, but from what I've seen the last ten years, MANY of the demos appeared to have value and weren't by any means the principal eyesore of the block.  Yet many of those crumbling walkups stand and the less challenging reclamation projects are lost to memory.

I'll be glad when Cincinnati is starting to hit its stride in 2017 or so, causing these demos to come to a dry trickle citywide.  Then again, it's a probability that the Westside and Avondale will still be going through this.

It seems like the city's solution to blight is to demo a building, and after wards often causes more of an eyesore, as it becomes overgrown, weedy mess. The city needs to focus on restoring historical buildings, and allowing new buildings that fit in with the character of the neighborhood, not turn everything into stuff for Yuppies. Let's face it, the area where they're building this will never be a Yuppie area, it'll always be a college student area. They need to put in affordable housing, and put in some more variety for foods, even if it means fast food. That area needs a late night dinning option besides Papa Dino's, a Steak n Shake in this new building would do extremely well, both providing the need for late night food, as well as affordable dinning option.

[Rob Jaques]

The city cannot "put in" new options for food. They can build the infrastructure, encourage affordable housing, but ultimately the developer will be deciding whether there is a market for market-rate housing or not. Towne has not released (as far as I know) if this is going to be mixed-income affordable and market-rate housing. I think they understand that they need to build for college students, they have to build for the market they see. As far as food options, the developer can court certain restaurants/retailers, but ultimately they will determine if they locate there, not the city of the developer.

[nati streets]

From what I've heard, the University has owned that property between McMillan and Calhoun for something like 30 years and were just sitting on it.

Its a bit more complicated than that.  Including the University lending money to two different developer groups to finance something happening on the site, then one group folding, not to mention relatively bad public reaction to the demolition of the area, and three different university presidents who have different priorities/views about what is important to the university.

[The_Cincinnati_Kid]

I don't believe it was acquired until the mid 1990s or so.

[neilworms]

The demos of buildings like the ones here are why I'm so pissed about what's going on in Corryville on Euclid.

I also just got back from San Francisco, and parts of it reminded me of living in old pics of downtown Cincinnati from the 1940s... literally both cities share a surprising amount of architecture.  The non financial district part of downtown was like a larger version of Cincy's downtown with more hills, no parking lots, streetcars and trolleybuses.

[City Blights]

The demos of buildings like the ones here are why I'm so pissed about what's going on in Corryville on Euclid.

I also just got back from San Francisco, and parts of it reminded me of living in old pics of downtown Cincinnati from the 1940s... literally both cities share a surprising amount of architecture.  The non financial district part of downtown was like a larger version of Cincy's downtown with more hills, no parking lots, streetcars and trolleybuses.

The amount of industrialist-era architecture that has been demo'd in Corryville since the 90's is disgusting.  Pretty soon there will be so little of the classic styles that have defined Corryville as an urban extension of Cincinnati's downtown neighborhoods that people won't remember what it used to look like and represent.  I'm hoping the streetcar can save this city from killing off its history in entirety in the form of new urban townhouses.  I'm more than willing to accept a less ornate version of what's been demo'd over something that doesn't fit the fabric of this city.

[UncleRando]

From what I've heard, the University has owned that property between McMillan and Calhoun for something like 30 years and were just sitting on it.

30 years does not sound correct, but I do think that the university has had some element of ownership since the 90's when everything was torn down. The intent was to build right away, but then they got caught up in an eminent domain legal battle and then the economy tanked. Before you know it 20 years has passed and we're just now starting to see progress.

[jmicha]

As a small update, there were surveyors out and about on the site about a week ago and on Friday (if I recall) they were doing soil tests.

[The_Cincinnati_Kid]

This is good news, does anyone know the exact cross street(s)?

University Square at the Loop brings green housing and retail to Uptown
Tuesday, May 10, 2011  

A new residential, retail, and office space will break ground this summer in the backyard of the University of Cincinnati's campus.  Located between Calhoun and McMillan streets, University Square at the Loop is a joint effort with developers Towne Properties and Al Neyer Inc.

http://www.soapboxmedia.com/devnews/0510universitysquareattheloop.aspx

[jmecklenborg]

Looks like The Banks.  I have no idea which way this thing is going to be oriented, but my hunch is that the plaza will be opposite St. George. 

[Civvik]

What's with all the beige brick lately? This isn't Omaha.

[edale]

I thought this development was going to go just west of the Shell station and Urban Outfitters.  Is it actually going to be in the lot across from St. George's? Both lots need to be developed badly, so i'll take development on either site.

[jmecklenborg]

It's definitely the lot adjacent to Vine St., where Prime Time and the old McDonald's were. 

[jmicha]

The side street doesn't look anywhere near steep enough to be the lot across from St. George. If I remember correctly the original concept had a half-circular plaza  bisected by a new road across from the open space between UPA and Calhoun Hall. It appears to me that this is what is pictured in the article.

[OCtoCincy]

jmicha is right- 

They are closing off Hartshorn street and moving it over so the intersection is opposite the parking garage entrance between UPA and Calhoun. 
The image we are looking at is from the perspective of above the roof of the UPA, looking southwest- ie. Clifton ave is to the right of the buildings in this image.

Phase 1 of U Square at the loop is from the back of the buildings abutting Clifton, to the back of the shell station at Ohio Ave.

Phase 2 is the development across from St. George.

[OCtoCincy]

Clifton is on the Left of this image, UC is above the image.

And it looks like the banks because it's the same architects-  CR Architecture (formerly Cole + Russell). 

[jmecklenborg]

Okay -- I stand corrected.  I was confused by all of the changes to the name of this project. 

[OCtoCincy]

^ no worries-

Phase 2 - the St. George/Vine area- will be a large office building- not residential. 



Vine/Calhoun intersection is the bottom of the image- you can see the residential part of U Square in the distance.

Interestingly enough- the numbers provided on the architechts website are very different from those provided in the most recent SoapBox Article

Office Space: 
Arch: 115,000 sq/feet
SoapBox: 44,000 sq/feet

Parking:
Arch: 1,100 spaces
SoapBox: 716 spaces

I'm guessing this is because the SoapBox Article is NOT referencing any of the phase 2 development-  Just from the image I'd guess the building we're looking at could be 60,000 square feet of office space with around 350 parking spaces underneath it...

That or the project has been scaled back quite a bit.

[mcadrenaline]

U Square @ The Loop got lots of looks at ICSC show
http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/blog/2011/05/u-square-the-loop-got-lots-of-looks.html

lots of info about letters of intent in here...some interesting retailers looking to enter!

[jmicha]

If there is a Mellow Mushroom in this development I will deem it a success. I absolutely love Mellow Mushroom.

[The_Cincinnati_Kid]

Amid sniping, council approves $80M Clifton Heights complex
1:00 PM, Jun. 27, 2011 


Developers plan to break ground this fall on an $80 million-plus Clifton Heights complex of apartments, retail space and offices after City Council on Monday approved up to $25 million to help pay for it.

The project, called U Square @ The Loop, will repopulate the vacant land between McMillan and Calhoun streets near the University of Cincinnati. The city plans to sell bonds to come up with the money, which will be repaid from payments people make to park in the two new garages that will be part of the project and with revenue from the Tax Increment Financing (TIF) District, revenue generated by development in an area, often used to underwrite future projects.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20110627/NEWS0108/106280308/

[jmicha]

So after having been home all summer in Cleveland I was expecting some sort of visual sign of something happening on the site. To my surprise, the only construction I could see in the area was the new Adriatico's building (which is looking pretty decent compared to the Shirley's box). Maybe I missed an update to the schedule, but the last I heard August was supposed to be the start date. Has anybody heard anything about this project's schedule as I know the signs are still touting a 2012 school year opening.

[Blue Line]

Really getting upset again over this. What's the hold up THIS time?

[mcadrenaline]

it's always something with this project. incredibly frustrated as well. I'm chalking it up to "believe it when I see it" status at this point.

[taestell]

For me, this project moved to "believe it when I see it" status many months ago when they changed the name to "Uptown Commons".

[OCtoCincy]

Ya, very strange-  They haven't even started grading, or clearing the site, etc. even the most BASIC beginnings of construction haven't started.

[taestell]

"UC plans to lease space in the new U Square@the Loop development between McMillan and Calhoun Streets on the southern edge of campus."

I guess that means UC has confidence that U Square will be built soon... perhaps they imposed some sort of deadline on CHCURC?

http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20110919/NEWS0102/309200002/