Author Topic: Cincinnati Streetcar News  (Read 1685694 times)

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Offline RockyMountainHigh

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19355 on: February 04, 2013, 05:33:07 PM »
Steve Chabot will be on Brian Thomas 55wkrc at 7:40 am tomorrow. Here was the poll on Brian's wkrc page...

How do you think the judge will rule on the streetcar issue?

Side with the city and Duke will have to increase rates to pay for the line move?

Or...

Side with Duke and city will have to come up with the money?

I think I'd rather listen to a sputtering lawnmower struggling to cut exceptionally high grass.

And nice way that Thomas worded his poll question, making the city out to be either the bad guy or the loser in this whole thing.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2013, 05:39:02 PM by RockyMountainHigh »

Offline natininja

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19356 on: February 04, 2013, 06:00:56 PM »
How does this project continue to keep the interest of average radio listeners? Really makes no sense. As interested as I am in the project, I couldn't listen to someone talking about it for hours each week.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2013, 06:05:30 PM by natininja »
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Offline KJP

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19357 on: February 04, 2013, 06:15:29 PM »
Steve Chabot will be on Brian Thomas 55wkrc at 7:40 am tomorrow. Here was the poll on Brian's wkrc page...

How do you think the judge will rule on the streetcar issue?

Side with the city and Duke will have to increase rates to pay for the line move?

Or...

Side with Duke and city will have to come up with the money?

These guys sure do live in an alternate dimension. I think someone ought to go on their show to do an in-studio interview posing as a streetcar opponent and then start sharing some facts. Maybe they'll end up bleeding from their ears.

How does this project continue to keep the interest of average radio listeners? Really makes no sense. As interested as I am in the project, I couldn't listen to someone talking about it for hours each week.

It's probably why some people can work on an assembly for 30 years and never get tired of it. If you take someone out of their routine and suggest a change, I sincerely believe they will suffer a panic attack. It's why some people can live in the same small town, or in the same house in a big city all their lives and be just fine. And that's probably why this radio station appeals to them. It never changes and is always with them in their safe little homes, er, bunkers. That's probably also why the streetcar scares the living hell out of them -- because it is a big change.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2013, 06:22:38 PM by KJP »
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Offline GCrites80s

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19358 on: February 04, 2013, 07:49:38 PM »
There's also a bunch of guys working in shops by the Mill Creek or Norwood or whatever that play WLW (or KRC) all day at work that think that they are the only people on Earth that work and see improvements in public transit as another handout for people who are lazy and on (non-existent) general assistance welfare.

Offline Quimbob

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19359 on: February 04, 2013, 09:20:38 PM »
Steve Chabot will be on Brian Thomas 55wkrc at 7:40 am tomorrow. Here was the poll on Brian's wkrc page...

How do you think the judge will rule on the streetcar issue?

Side with the city and Duke will have to increase rates to pay for the line move?

Or...

Side with Duke and city will have to come up with the money?

These guys sure do live in an alternate dimension. I think someone ought to go on their show to do an in-studio interview posing as a streetcar opponent and then start sharing some facts. Maybe they'll end up bleeding from their ears.

How does this project continue to keep the interest of average radio listeners? Really makes no sense. As interested as I am in the project, I couldn't listen to someone talking about it for hours each week.

It's probably why some people can work on an assembly for 30 years and never get tired of it. If you take someone out of their routine and suggest a change, I sincerely believe they will suffer a panic attack. It's why some people can live in the same small town, or in the same house in a big city all their lives and be just fine. And that's probably why this radio station appeals to them. It never changes and is always with them in their safe little homes, er, bunkers. That's probably also why the streetcar scares the living hell out of them -- because it is a big change.
You could put some of these clowns in a Kafka Penal Colony thingamajig & they would still NEVER figure it out.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. - H. L. Mencken

Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19360 on: February 04, 2013, 10:20:14 PM »
>all day at work

Don't forget truck drivers, salesmen, and others who spend huge amounts of time in cars as captive audiences.  You can pick up 700 for hours in any direction. 

Offline Losantiville

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19361 on: February 05, 2013, 08:49:26 AM »
I think it's overly simplifying the situation to suggest that the only listeners of WLW throughout the day are blue collar, but the characterization isn't completely off the mark.  I personally know several individuals who work in shops or drive trucks and perfectly fit this description.  It's just terribly, negatively reinforcing. 

It is telling that the streetcar opponents specifically, and the GOP at large, have conquered only one form of media: antiquated AM radio.  They are behind the times and will continue to fall further behind as the world moves on without them. 

Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19362 on: February 05, 2013, 12:05:32 PM »
>have conquered only one form of media: antiquated AM radio.

Don't forget the chain emails of shadowy origins. 

But I do wonder sometimes if the direction the Republican Party took during Clinton and since was a direct response to what makes for "good radio".  Somehow Rush Limbaugh stumbled upon a formula that has been successfully copied by at least 100 other national and regional hosts around the county.  From what I remember Bill Cunningham's show was very different before Rush/Clinton -- much more positive on national and local matters.  None of the self-loathing and anti-city stuff that has come to define local talk radio for the past twenty years.     

Offline KJP

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19363 on: February 05, 2013, 12:58:14 PM »
Dear Cincinnatians for Progress, please understand you are not alone in your fight against the sticks in the mud.

Signed, Portlanders for Progress

http://www.masstransitmag.com/news/10873819/wa-light-rail-foes-promise-clash-of-the-titans
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Offline CincyCapell

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19364 on: February 05, 2013, 01:13:40 PM »
Mark Miller has created yet another Twitter account in order to attack the Streetcar: @PlumStPlayPen. It's very obviously Miller, you can tell by what he's tweeting and use of the word "boondoggle". And guess who is following that account; good old Biased Barry Horstman.

Offline neilworms

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19365 on: February 05, 2013, 01:16:22 PM »
Quote
Don't forget the chain emails of shadowy origins. 

But I do wonder sometimes if the direction the Republican Party took during Clinton and since was a direct response to what makes for "good radio".  Somehow Rush Limbaugh stumbled upon a formula that has been successfully copied by at least 100 other national and regional hosts around the county.  From what I remember Bill Cunningham's show was very different before Rush/Clinton -- much more positive on national and local matters.  None of the self-loathing and anti-city stuff that has come to define local talk radio for the past twenty years. 

I think long term this kind of thing (both the emails and talk radio) are on their way out.   How many people under 40 listen to talk radio? I know no one.  How many people under 40 actually trust said emails or distrbute them? (again tends to be middle aged co-workers).

Those emails are horrible IMO, most of them should be replied to with an automatic link to snopes.com.  Not all are political either but most are out to scare.  I saw one about putting drugs in kids candy which was completely ridiculous but the middle aged people in our office ate it up.

Offline neilworms

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19366 on: February 05, 2013, 01:18:08 PM »
Quote
http://www.masstransitmag.com/news/10873819/wa-light-rail-foes-promise-clash-of-the-titans

I didn't think people existed like this along the coasts in the Pacific Northwest.  Thought they were mostly in the mountains and basin desert areas.

Offline Quimbob

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19367 on: February 05, 2013, 01:21:07 PM »
Henry Wallace predicted the voice of American fascism would be the radio back around 1950.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. - H. L. Mencken

Offline FakeCinEnquirer

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19368 on: February 05, 2013, 01:34:01 PM »
Dear Cincinnatians for Progress, please understand you are not alone in your fight against the sticks in the mud.

Signed, Portlanders for Progress

http://www.masstransitmag.com/news/10873819/wa-light-rail-foes-promise-clash-of-the-titans

C_AST just tweeted your link.  It's pretty evident that they obsess about this site 24/7 for all things streetcar related.

Hi Mark!

Offline ProkNo5

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19369 on: February 05, 2013, 01:34:10 PM »
Goodness.  STREETCAR TO NOWHERE...in Charlotte.

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Offline GCrites80s

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19370 on: February 05, 2013, 01:39:20 PM »
Quote
Don't forget the chain emails of shadowy origins. 

Those emails are horrible IMO, most of them should be replied to with an automatic link to snopes.com.  Not all are political either but most are out to scare.  I saw one about putting drugs in kids candy which was completely ridiculous but the middle aged people in our office ate it up.


As long as something is said (or written) it's got to be true!
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 01:40:21 PM by GCrites80s »

Offline FakeCinEnquirer

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19371 on: February 05, 2013, 01:39:46 PM »
Mark Miller has created yet another Twitter account in order to attack the Streetcar: @PlumStPlayPen. It's very obviously Miller, you can tell by what he's tweeting and use of the word "boondoggle". And guess who is following that account; good old Biased Barry Horstman.

Why would an anonymous twitter account...with only 46 tweets....And 14 followers....get a follow from Fox19(Who only follows only 333 people out of 8462 followers)?   
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 01:40:39 PM by FakeCinEnquirer »

Offline natininja

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19372 on: February 05, 2013, 01:39:47 PM »
Quote
http://www.masstransitmag.com/news/10873819/wa-light-rail-foes-promise-clash-of-the-titans

I didn't think people existed like this along the coasts in the Pacific Northwest.  Thought they were mostly in the mountains and basin desert areas.

The coasts are a lot more like Ohio than the media and conventional wisdom would have you believe. Just go to the bluest cities' newspapers and read the comment sections. Racism, anti-urbanism, etc., all over the place. America has a good number of "conservatives," from sea to shining sea. If I got to feeling like Cincinnati was too conservative for me, I would have to leave the country to escape the feeling.
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Offline KJP

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19373 on: February 05, 2013, 02:16:26 PM »
Why would an anonymous twitter account...with only 46 tweets....And 14 followers....get a follow from Fox19(Who only follows only 333 people out of 8462 followers)?   

That's very disturbing, as is Horstman choosing to be one its few followers. Says a lot about their media coverage, doesn't it?

Long ago I removed myself from covering rail topics for Sun Newspapers in Cleveland. I think it's time we ask they voluntarily remove themselves from covering the streetcar. Of course, we shouldn't have to ask. Any responsible journalist should recognize when they have a problem in being objective on a particular subject. That is, unless they consider their ego and their desire to preach their personal beliefs to be more important than objectively sharing what they objectively learn.
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Offline CincyCapell

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19374 on: February 05, 2013, 02:17:50 PM »
Dear Cincinnatians for Progress, please understand you are not alone in your fight against the sticks in the mud.

Signed, Portlanders for Progress

http://www.masstransitmag.com/news/10873819/wa-light-rail-foes-promise-clash-of-the-titans

Notice in that article how the anti-railers lost their petition drive, and their candidates lost their bids for office. Yet these sore losers are going to sue because they aren't getting their way. Why do ant-rail zealots hate democracy so much?

Offline CincyCapell

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19375 on: February 05, 2013, 02:26:21 PM »
Mark Miller has created yet another Twitter account in order to attack the Streetcar: @PlumStPlayPen. It's very obviously Miller, you can tell by what he's tweeting and use of the word "boondoggle". And guess who is following that account; good old Biased Barry Horstman.

Why would an anonymous twitter account...with only 46 tweets....And 14 followers....get a follow from Fox19(Who only follows only 333 people out of 8462 followers)?

Enquirer political reporter Carl Weiser is also following, as though Miller is going to tweet some profound political statement from his fake account.

Offline KJP

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19376 on: February 05, 2013, 02:40:34 PM »
Notice in that article how the anti-railers lost their petition drive, and their candidates lost their bids for office. Yet these sore losers are going to sue because they aren't getting their way. Why do ant-rail zealots hate democracy so much?

Moreso, why do they hate variety and diversity so much? Does everything have to be so dull and homogeneous?

Hey, if you want your suburbia with all your cars, fundamentalist churches, concealed weapons and stepford wives, then have it. We may bitch about having to subsidize your polluting lifestyles but we won't stop you. Just let us have our walkable, transit-friendly, diverse, socially engaging, architecturally uplifting, historic urban cores where everyone else is welcome. We might even let you crazy suburbanites in once in a while to see a ballgame. But you have to park where we tell you, OK?
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Offline CincyGuy45202

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19377 on: February 05, 2013, 11:44:09 PM »
Mark Miller has created yet another Twitter account in order to attack the Streetcar: @PlumStPlayPen. It's very obviously Miller, you can tell by what he's tweeting and use of the word "boondoggle". And guess who is following that account; good old Biased Barry Horstman.

Why would an anonymous twitter account...with only 46 tweets....And 14 followers....get a follow from Fox19(Who only follows only 333 people out of 8462 followers)?

The person hints at being a city hall employee. I wonder if they work in PG's office.

Offline CincyCapell

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19378 on: February 05, 2013, 11:47:26 PM »
David Mann wants to come out of his carbonite deep freeze and try for another run at council, running on a theme of  “financial sustainability". Anyone really wonder what side of the streetcar "debate" (such as it exists among suburban 700WLW listeners, TOAST, Barry Horstman and Smitherman) that Mann will come down on? TOAST is already proclaiming Mann to be 'the adult in the room', along with Smitherman (HA-HA!).
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 11:48:11 PM by CincyCapell »

Offline Quimbob

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19379 on: February 06, 2013, 04:51:22 AM »
^ and the Windbag
Maybe 'adult' means mentally ill.
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Offline Rabbit Hash

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19380 on: February 06, 2013, 07:56:05 AM »
I could have sworn I read a quote by Mann that says he is not opposed.

Offline Quimbob

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19381 on: February 06, 2013, 08:31:28 AM »
I could have sworn I read a quote by Mann that says he is not opposed.
This might just be pandering to both sides - he's been in politics a while.

One of the most hotly debated issues in Cincinnati has been the city’s planned $128 million, 3.8-mile streetcar line, which might be expanded if the first phase proves successful.
“The voters have twice given it the go-ahead and I respect that. I wouldn’t change it at this point,” Mann said. “But it’s something that should be carefully looked at every step of the way.”

http://www.wcpo.com/dpp/news/local_news/After-long-absence-David-Mann-seeks-return-to-Cincinnati-City-Council
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Offline Jimmy_James

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19382 on: February 06, 2013, 03:55:39 PM »
I frankly don't know what Cranley's ax to grind is. As I understand it he is a candidate for Mayor of Cincinnati and vows he will stop the streetcar no matter where it is.

It's possible that he's just taking the "other side" of this issue.  Qualls is a staunch streetcar supporter, and is probably the favorite.  The streetcar, while having passed 2 votes, is still relatively unpopular, since the votes were close.  And for the people who don't like the project, it seems to be their #1 issue, regardless of facts, reason, or common sense.  So, by making himself the anti-streetcar mayoral candidate, he automatically becomes Qualls' biggest competition.  That, plus a little luck, could be enough for him to sneak into office.  I certainly hope that doesn't happen, but it's his best chance against someone like Qualls who is vastly more qualified.

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Offline natininja

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19383 on: February 06, 2013, 04:02:21 PM »
And for the people a vocal minority who don't like the project, it seems to be their #1 issue, regardless of facts, reason, or common sense.

FTFY.

This is the flaw in Cranley's strategy. If it were true, we wouldn't have a streetcar-supporting supermajority on council. It might be a media darling, and some people certainly are rabidly opposed to it, but the opposition is overblown.
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Offline Jimmy_James

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19384 on: February 06, 2013, 06:11:55 PM »
^49% of voters chose yes on Issue 48 in 2011.  That's close enough for me to be worried about the support he'll get with an anti-streetcar stance.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2013, 06:12:14 PM by Jimmy_James »
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Offline natininja

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19385 on: February 06, 2013, 06:57:29 PM »
My point is 49% of voters did not refuse to vote for pro-streetcar council and mayoral candidates. It's not the #1 issue for those voters.
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Offline kjbrill

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19386 on: February 06, 2013, 06:57:45 PM »
^49% of voters chose yes on Issue 48 in 2011.  That's close enough for me to be worried about the support he'll get with an anti-streetcar stance.

If that is enough to put Cranley in there with his stop the streetcar stance, I feel very bad about Cincinnati. Let's have both a failed subway and a failed streetcar. The citizens may have to speak up for the third time, and I hope they speak loud and clear.

Offline natininja

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19387 on: February 06, 2013, 07:01:25 PM »
^49% of voters chose yes on Issue 48 in 2011.  That's close enough for me to be worried about the support he'll get with an anti-streetcar stance.

If that is enough to put Cranley in there with his stop the streetcar stance, I feel very bad about Cincinnati. Let's have both a failed subway and a failed streetcar. The citizens may have to speak up for the third time, and I hope they speak loud and clear.

I'm not really worried about it. The only thing slightly disturbing is the campaign funding situation.
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Offline Jimmy_James

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19388 on: February 06, 2013, 08:20:39 PM »
I sincerely hope you're right.
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Offline jmecklenborg

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Re: Cincinnati Streetcar News
« Reply #19389 on: February 07, 2013, 01:07:57 AM »
http://www.wcpo.com/dpp/news/region_central_cincinnati/downtown/horseshoe-casino-cincinnati-plans-complimentary-shuttle-service-with-partner-hotels

Watch for streetcar opponents to start citing whatever this casino shuttle is going to be as a reason why private businesses are good and publicly supported streetcars are bad.

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